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Episode 275 — Party of Lincoln


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#1 July Diaz

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Posted 11 November 2013 - 11:23 PM

Emily Yoshida & Andrew talk about the Republican party calling themselves the “party of Lincoln.” Make sure to leave us a message about anything you think is racist at (323) 389-RACE and be sure to keep it under 30 seconds everyone.

#2 Joshie

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 11:12 AM

1. If you are trying to answer racism questions and don't know about Nixon's Southern Strategy and all that awful shifting of politics it's probably time to pack it in. That's some 101-level shit

2. It stinks of presentism to say Lincoln wouldn't be a Republican today. He was against slavery, but he still had awful racial views. It doesn't do anyone any favors in learning about history to pretend his views would fit in with progressive views today. As late as 1862 James Redpath recorded Lincoln’s saying of President Fabre Nicholas Geffard of Haiti offering to send a white man as a diplomat rather than a black man if that's what he preferred, “You can tell the President of Hayti that I shan’t tear my shirt if he sends a nigger here!” Lincoln was very much like a modern Republican establishment politician, in that he did certain things to create an image of someone more racially polite and understanding than he was while in private he still used racial slurs, told awful jokes, etc.

edit: changed last part

Edited by Joshie, 13 November 2013 - 03:26 PM.


#3 Shariq Torres

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Posted 13 November 2013 - 07:36 AM

View PostJoshie, on 12 November 2013 - 11:12 AM, said:

1. If you are trying to answer racism questions and don't know about Nixon's Southern Strategy and all that awful shifting of politics it's probably time to pack it in. That's some 101-level shit

2. It stinks of presentism to say Lincoln wouldn't be a Republican today. He was against slavery, but he still had awful racial views. It doesn't do anyone any favors in learning about history to pretend his views would fit in with progressive views today. As late as 1862 James Redpath recorded Lincoln’s saying of President Fabre Nicholas Geffard of Haiti offering to send a white man as a diplomat rather than a black man if that's what he preferred, “You can tell the President of Hayti that I shan’t tear my shirt if he sends a nigger here!” Lincoln was very much like a modern Republican, he was sort of tolerant of black people in official positions rather than working the fields, but privately, he still used racial slurs, told awful jokes, etc.


Modern Republicans aren't tolerant of black people in official positions at all. Look at how they treat the president.

#4 Joshie

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Posted 13 November 2013 - 03:21 PM

View PostShariq Torres, on 13 November 2013 - 07:36 AM, said:


Modern Republicans aren't tolerant of black people in official positions at all. Look at how they treat the president.


Ugh yeah a lot of those tea party folks are really gross, I don't want to give them any credit. I don't know the right words for what I am trying to express. I just want to convey the sentiment that Lincoln was anti-slavery, because he believed no human being of any kind should be in that condition, and it was the United States job to be against that sort of thing, but that he wasn't anti-racist or condemning racists or would condemn racists today as Andrew Ti ignorantly claims. He thought a bit more highly of the potential of folks of African descent than Southern slaveholders did, obviously thought one could be a diplomat, but he was still a racist, and not as respectful of nonwhite folks. It's not correct to claim since he was progressive in 1860 he'd be progressive in 2013.

"I have no purpose to introduce political and social equality between the white and black races. There is physical difference between the two which, in my judgment, will probably forever forbid their living together, and I ... am in favor of the race to which I belong having the superior position." - Illinois senate race against Stephen Douglas

Also I saw in a PBS show they talked to Henry Louis Gates and there was evidence Lincoln floated the idea of a peace treaty with the Confederacy that would allow, on condition of surrender, the current generation of slaveholders to keep their slaves but not the next? (i.e., slavery would still exist until 1890 or 1900 in return for peace, but they rejected the idea)

Point is, the Republican Party leaders back then, and today, both try to create this PR image of being racially sensitive when it suits them politically, and yell at the Democrats, when in reality most of the people in the party and even the leaders in private (and occassionally in public when they slip up) are not actually like that and it's important to keep that in mind to discuss history