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JulyDiaz

Episode 166 - Timecop: LIVE!

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Okay so if you guys don't know me I really love puzzles and something about the convenience of this Trump-Timecop coincidence seemed too convenient.

 

Hear. Me. Out. I think JCVD is giving us an invitation to the next Kumite. See my attached solving notes for proof. They work out to say "Bath, United Kingdom. Save the date. JCVD"

 

This can only mean one thing. Bloodsport 3: Blood Bath

 

Don't forget, Timecop is an anagram for "top mice." Maybe it's a Kumite for rodents.

 

Okay, let me point out something else I had in my notes to get my mind off my sad phone call.

 

After JCVD finds his wife's blood vial in the hospital, he returns to Rueben's room to say he's going to get her out of there. Rueben is unresponsive, to which JCVD turns her head over and she's obviously dead as her heart monitor flatlines immediately. This is due to the baddies poisoning her IV. Did anyone else find this to seem a bit off? Like I don't doubt that she would die, but shouldn't the heart monitor show signs of some sort of irregular heartbeat before flatlining?? It's perfectly normal until JCVD touches her face!

 

So Ron Silva's henchmen didn't kill Rae Dawn Chong, it was 2004 JCVD!

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So in the future (our past, or the alternative 2004) the US constitution allows cruel and unusual punishment? They sentence the timecriminal that was doing the stock thing in the late 1920s to a death sentence, no ordinary death sentence though, they send this man back to die by massive bodily trauma falling from a great height. If you're going to sentence someone to death then why not just execute them by future lethal injection or future electric chair or future gas chamber? Also surely if you're trying to avoid fucking up the past then surely removing timecriminals is the least disruptive thing possible, why send people back in time to die when it will only risk changing the course of history, imagine who could've been in that paddy-wagon.

 

One more thing, the only true Timecop is the Time Trax bloke, didn't have JCVD's buns or splits ability but he also didn't let his wife die

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So in the future (our past, or the alternative 2004) the US constitution allows cruel and unusual punishment? They sentence the timecriminal that was doing the stock thing in the late 1920s to a death sentence, no ordinary death sentence though, they send this man back to die by massive bodily trauma falling from a great height. If you're going to sentence someone to death then why not just execute them by future lethal injection or future electric chair or future gas chamber? Also surely if you're trying to avoid fucking up the past then surely removing timecriminals is the least disruptive thing possible, why send people back in time to die when it will only risk changing the course of history, imagine who could've been in that paddy-wagon.

 

One more thing, the only true Timecop is the Time Trax bloke, didn't have JCVD's buns or splits ability but he also didn't let his wife die

 

Maybe, because he had already established his presence in the 20's, having him just "disappear" would raise too many questions which might result in additional time ripples?

 

Having him look like just another Wall Street suicide at that point in time would probably keep people from investigating or asking too many questions. I think it might be a situation where making sure all the loop holes are closed might trump ethics.

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Two thoughts occur after re-listening to the episode:

 

1. June asks if the movie audience should infer from the birdhouse video that Mia Sara is a skilled carpenter -- I think that we have to because somebody rebuilt that damn house.

 

2. Is anyone else bothered that '94 Ron Silva died? By that point, he hadn't yet become a time criminal with a cadre of goons -- he was just an honest [*cough*] politician investing in cutting edge time travel tech on the side. I know that JCVD and the TEC have powers of immediate execution, but can he execute someone for "pre-crime" a la Minority Report?

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Maybe, because he had already established his presence in the 20's, having him just "disappear" would raise too many questions that might result in additional time ripples?

 

Having him look like just another Wall Street suicide at that point in time would probably keep people from investigating or asking too many questions. I think it might be a situation where making sure all the loop holes are closed might trump ethics.

 

That was my guess, too ... otherwise, there's no reason to show the change in the cop's reaction.

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Also in case you haven't seen this here's the music video for the closing credits song "Time Won't Let Me" featuring a shirtless JVCD rocking a harmonica.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ljyt_45I6nw

I couldn't make it all the way through. When they turned into Civil War soldiers, I had to to stop it. Is it me or is JCVD listening to a different song? Because he is ROCKING OUT to the slower parts, not even the guitar solo.

 

Also is that Street Fighter hair I see?

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Give us a call On the REVAMPED - Q&A HOTLINE at 619-PAULASK

 

Ask me questions about your life, your job or love. I will answer them, and I guarantee that 25% of the time my answer is 100% right! -- It's a Google Number so charges might not apply.

 

Also, we having a HDTGM Merch sale at https://www.teepubli...-this-get-made/ Get 20% off using offer code "how-did-this-get-made"

Totally late on noticing this, but holy crap, my forum whining about the EHL welcome message worked! Thanks for listening, Paul!

 

Also: there seems to be enough material now that the entire EHL this week could be populated by forum people. Hopefully we all asked good questions!

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This is my metacorrection and omission post.

 

A lot of posters have brought up the inconsistency of JCVD's time car having to come back before it left 2004. I think this can be resolved by it arriving at the exact instance that it left; appearing to have not moved even though the car and its contents have traveled through time. This would resolve one issue with the scientific problems with Timecop, the conservation of mass. Though that opens things up to questioning how the mass transferred to the past exists. Maybe the act of time travel creates an opening in the closed system of universal mass.

 

Secondly the suggestion that Silva could go back in time and utilize a sports book to garner 50 million dollars is a little unrealistic. Bets that pay out more than a few ten thousand dollars would be very rare and suspicious. He would have to place 500 wagers that payed out $100,000 to get there. There only a few sports booking organizations that could withstand those kinds of losses and they would be highly incentivized to track down who was burning them. It seems like future mob bosses might acquire time travel technology ala Looper to prevent this exact thing from happening. Placing smaller wagers would add a shit load of extra work. These are the exact things that should be ringing Timecop alarm bells.

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Secondly the suggestion that Silva could go back in time and utilize a sports book to garner 50 million dollars is a little unrealistic. Bets that pay out more than a few ten thousand dollars would be very rare and suspicious. He would have to place 500 wagers that payed out $100,000 to get there. There only a few sports booking organizations that could withstand those kinds of losses and they would be highly incentivized to track down who was burning them. It seems like future mob bosses might acquire time travel technology ala Looper to prevent this exact thing from happening. Placing smaller wagers would add a shit load of extra work. These are the exact things that should be ringing Timecop alarm bells.

You could make that amount only making a small big bets on huge upsets and some of the proven biggest bet wins of all time especially huge upsets which could be deemed as luck to bookies or casinos. One guy made a bet on a particular jockey winning all of his races on a given day, and made what amounted to almost 900k off a 100 dollar bet, converted from pounds. A guy won 760k from a 10 cent bent on a superfecta at the horse races in 2008, so who's to say that they couldn't do the same on any race within reason. Or even putting a big bet on the Mike Tyson/Buster Douglas where Douglas was a 42-1 underdog. It could be done reasonably well by McComb and his crew to do appearing as either a whale in the casino or a lucky better and reach the desired amount, raising the same number of eyebrows if they basically ended up owning major shares in the biggest success stories from the Depression.

 

Plus if mobsters or poor loses wanted to hunt down who beat them so soundly, just whip out some future weapons and blow their asses away before going back to the present.

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* After editing out the guy taylor anne mentioned in the last thread

 

He must also have been the guy who tried to "heynongman" Jason, who shot that down pretty quick.

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Something just occurred to me, I think it was Jason that pointed out that the bad guys look smooth as fuck when they travel back in time but JCVD always ends up stumbling into the past on a highway or in the middle of the ocean or whatever - the man they execute didn't just end up somewhere in New York City, he ended up in the middle of the air 20 storeys up. So this makes me conclude that the tech guys are just fucking with JCVD when they send him back, they tell him they can't do anything about it that's just the way you time travel - "yeah sorry Max Walker we couldn't send you back to somewhere safe you totally accidentally travelled back in time and appeared in a sewer outlet pipe. What are the odds right(?)"

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Two thoughts occur after re-listening to the episode:

 

1. June asks if the movie audience should infer from the birdhouse video that Mia Sara is a skilled carpenter -- I think that we have to because somebody rebuilt that damn house.

 

 

i like to think she was a young architect and this house was her dream project as she was growing up. that's why she was building the birdhouse. it's probably a model she built a thousand times growing up. and that's why/how she rebuilt the house after it got blown up. and maybe she comes from a wealthy family of architects and that's how they can afford such an expensive property in the first place. can't imagine cops earn enough to pay for something like this. i mean they should but i doubt they ever will. even timecops.

 

but mainly i like to think she's an architect so that this would be the second time travel movie featuring an architect that HDTGM covered. that way timecop and the lake house are suddenly part of a very niche genre of movie.

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I'm gonna point out another time jump in the episode for those who weren't there. Early in the show, after June is introduced, you may hear periodically a light hissing sound. This was addressed during the show for a bit with Paul (I think) questioning if the theater was deflating. It ended up being a technical issue with June's mic, and the theater staff replaced it a bit later. I'm surprised they cut it out so seamlessly. I understand why, but it was pretty funny, so I'm a little sad lol

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it's probably a model she built a thousand times growing up. and that's why/how she rebuilt the house after it got blown up.

 

I thought this might be the case too, but after re-watching the scene, she actually has no clue what she's doing. She's reading out the instructions and immediately throws up her hands a the whole project. She says something like, "I guess I should have started with something easier..." It's at that point that JCVD walks over to her, and like he's talking to a fucking child, mansplains the crap out of the instructions and tells her exactly how she needs to arrange the pieces. Of course, that's when she starts making out with him full-blownsies on their front lawn, because, of course she does...

 

ETA: I haven't had a chance to listen to the episode yet, so if anything I'm saying is mentioned on the episode, I'm sorry :)

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It was mentioned that the time travel in The Lake House was more logical and easy to grasp than the time travel in Timecop. This is unequivocally false!!!

 

First, I must acknowledge the hard work everybody thus far has put into charting and plotting out the time travel elements of this movie. Granted it can be hard to follow because you have multiple people traveling to various locations over various times. Compared that to The Lake House and it's enchanted time traveling mailbox it seems rather complicated. However, it's that simplicity that does The Lake House in. In The Lake House Sandra Bullock and Keanu Reeves are not traveling through time. Nor are they crossing into any alternate realities or timelines. Unlike Timecop they remain constant in a singular timeline which when you think about it makes no sense. Let's take the case of the magical appearing tree in The Lake House. Sandy B is in a rain storm when all of a sudden a tree appears to provide her shelter when there wasn't one there. Keanu planted it two years ago so none of that should have happened! That tree should have always been there. It's not a time traveling tree that appears two years from the moment he plants it. It's a regular tree! She shouldn't have been shocked or wet because that tree should have already been there. Look at a similar scene in Timecop. Ron Silva gets kicked in the face by JVCD leaving him with a scar. At that moment a scar appears on his future self's face. Did that scar travel into the future? No it was a new event that happened in the past which altered things. Notice how Ron Silva didn't grasp his face and wonder what happened. He didn't react because for 2004 Ron Silva that scar had been there for years.

 

Next The Lake House is full of paradoxes and actions with no consequences. Keanu and Sandra bullock both use their knowledge to effect things. Now as we and Timecop both know that changing the past creates a paradox. In Timecop there is talk about time ripples and we see how this events do effect the timeline when JVCD returns to a different future than the one he left. The whole world is effected by these changes, yet in The Lake House lives are altered and saved with no effect to the world. Again, Sandy B and Keanu are not moving in time only the letters are. If she sent a letter to two years in the past to save his life, in two years time he would be alive and at the architecture firm and give her no cause to go and send the letter to the past to save his life. This means the letter would not be sent which means he would be dead, which means she would send the letter, etc. Now we're stuck in a time loop. Timecop has more moving parts but with the exception of the exploding house, all the actions have consequences in the future when JVCD returns to it. Ron Silva gets his younger self to infest in microchips and now he runs things in the future when he didn't in scenes prior. Ron Silva is killed, he can't bride or influence Rae Dawn Chong into being evil so she's a regular cop. The actions of time travel have real consequences that we can see in Timecop. Things are in a not in a loop because they alter the universe.

 

At the end of the day it comes down to this. Timecop has multiple people traveling through time whose actions change the timeline. It appears complicated but if charted and thought out makes sense. The Lake House only the letters travel through time and the people and things we see are suppose to be static. Yet they change thing and things appear when they shouldn't, events occur that shouldn't occur and no amount of charting and logic will ever make any of it make sense.

 

In conclusion, fuck The Lake House!

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Something just occurred to me, I think it was Jason that pointed out that the bad guys look smooth as fuck when they travel back in time but JCVD always ends up stumbling into the past on a highway or in the middle of the ocean or whatever - the man they execute didn't just end up somewhere in New York City, he ended up in the middle of the air 20 storeys up. So this makes me conclude that the tech guys are just fucking with JCVD when they send him back, they tell him they can't do anything about it that's just the way you time travel - "yeah sorry Max Walker we couldn't send you back to somewhere safe you totally accidentally travelled back in time and appeared in a sewer outlet pipe. What are the odds right(?)"

 

Trivia on imdb says this was intentional. Actor/Activist Ron Silva is supposed to appear to have plenty of time while JCVD doesn't.

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Something just occurred to me, I think it was Jason that pointed out that the bad guys look smooth as fuck when they travel back in time but JCVD always ends up stumbling into the past on a highway or in the middle of the ocean or whatever - the man they execute didn't just end up somewhere in New York City, he ended up in the middle of the air 20 storeys up. So this makes me conclude that the tech guys are just fucking with JCVD when they send him back, they tell him they can't do anything about it that's just the way you time travel - "yeah sorry Max Walker we couldn't send you back to somewhere safe you totally accidentally travelled back in time and appeared in a sewer outlet pipe. What are the odds right(?)"

It's because JCVD doesn't respect the sanctity of a person's name on their lunchbag in the office fridge.

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It's because JCVD doesn't respect the sanctity of a person's name on their lunchbag in the office fridge.

 

Well, that's just savagery. JCVD deserves to have a close call with a freight truck for eating the last of the cold morning-after pizza.

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You could make that amount only making a small big bets on huge upsets and some of the proven biggest bet wins of all time especially huge upsets which could be deemed as luck to bookies or casinos. One guy made a bet on a particular jockey winning all of his races on a given day, and made what amounted to almost 900k off a 100 dollar bet, converted from pounds. A guy won 760k from a 10 cent bent on a superfecta at the horse races in 2008, so who's to say that they couldn't do the same on any race within reason. Or even putting a big bet on the Mike Tyson/Buster Douglas where Douglas was a 42-1 underdog. It could be done reasonably well by McComb and his crew to do appearing as either a whale in the casino or a lucky better and reach the desired amount, raising the same number of eyebrows if they basically ended up owning major shares in the biggest success stories from the Depression.

 

Plus if mobsters or poor loses wanted to hunt down who beat them so soundly, just whip out some future weapons and blow their asses away before going back to the present.

 

Plus, if a bonafide butthead like Biff could do it, surely actor activist and senator could pull it off.

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I couldn't make it all the way through. When they turned into Civil War soldiers, I had to to stop it. Is it me or is JCVD listening to a different song? Because he is ROCKING OUT to the slower parts, not even the guitar solo.

 

Also is that Street Fighter hair I see?

My first reaction after the shock of him shirtless but in a vest was "Where's the mullet?" but thinking of when it was filmed you're probably right.

 

I thought he was doing his best impression of Rick James in the video for Party All the Time

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Random questions about the movie:

 

- Why does it have to be a wall at the end? Why not a net or something like that? And why so close? Would it destroy the process if the wall/net was a little further down?

 

- I would understand having some tribute to the twins who died, but just two poorly washed blood stains? It seems so disrespectful to those two people who died in service of the country. And JCVD just makes dumb jokes about it.

 

- How can the bad guys send 3-4 people in the past at a time? They use the prototype, which somehow was a four-seater while the final version only allows for 2 people.

 

- At the briefing at the beginning, the military guy explain that they just invented time travel, and that they need a police force to regulate it, because someone already is using it to steal stuff from the past. They know the one guy who has that technology!

"This guy just invented time travel and there was a theft in the past, we'll need a police force to crack that mystery"

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- At the briefing at the beginning, the military guy explain that they just invented time travel, and that they need a police force to regulate it, because someone already is using it to steal stuff from the past. They know the one guy who has that technology!

"This guy just invented time travel and there was a theft in the past, we'll need a police force to crack that mystery"

 

Not only that, but at one point Silva says that all the the department should be disbanded and the time machine's should be destroyed, and I was just thinking, "Yes! Absolutely! That's a great idea!" Because from what I can tell, the Department of Time Crime is there to police a dangerous technology that only they themselves have! As seen when JCVD arrests his former partner, they are - quite literally - only policing the corrupt cops in their own department.

 

The fact of the matter is, based on the rules the movie itself sets up, Time Travel has no beneficial uses. You can't go to the future and it's illegal to go into the past for fear you might change something. Okay...so what's the point? Scrape it! Keep it out of the wrong hands you dodos!

 

(I still haven't listened to the episode. Nor have a I done a thourough read of the thread. If I'm stepping on anybody's point, I apologize. I'm going to try and listen tomorrow :) )

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The fact of the matter is, based on the rules the movie itself sets up, Time Travel has no beneficial uses. You can't go to the future and it's illegal to go into the past for fear you might change something. Okay...so what's the point? Scrape it! Keep it out of the wrong hands you dodos!

But then how are we gonna get more DNA for our dinosaur theme parks?

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