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Episode 82 — Apocalypse Crushes

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I get the complaining. The last two weeks deserved lots of comments for and against Case Closed. But someone insulting my movie because I didn't get a video game character's game right. It seems like more than bitterness and envy.

I just realized that vgfitzger is the star of the catchment Case Closed. What's your deal dude? I had you on the show. We had a good time. What makes you feel it's cool to insult Freak Dance? I am truly curious what your thinking is?

 

Just because someone disliked Freak Dance doesn't mean they're not a Besser fan.  Your body of work isn't like the old testament of the bible, I can pick and choose what I accept in my heart and still expect to be let into improv heaven.  So, to someone interested in preventing a torturous eternity, I wouldn't recommend either lying with a man as with a woman or watching Freak Dance.  

 

I figured you, as a sumptuously accomplished comedian, should be able to take a little ribbing about your old projects in stride.  Shall I cite my sources?  I only have one and it's wikipedia, but I think it helps my case:  http://en.wikipedia..../Roast_(comedy)  

 

What's your thinking on why it's not cool to flippantly insult Freak Dance?  Is it because I know you read the forum and should spare your feelings?  Or is it because you've had me on the show and I should consider you a friendly acquaintance?  You know what?  You're right.  Yeah, I really regret it and would delete it now if I knew that doing so wouldn't make you call me out as a fool and a coward.  I'm completely backpedaling, okay?  You win sir.  Please don't intellectually bully me any farther, I've had enough.  Let's talk sports sometime.

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I figured you, as a comedian, should be able to take a little ribbing about your old projects in stride.

 

You can agree with the philosophy or not, but one thing I've found to be pretty consistent, whether it's on podcasts, Twitter, or wherever, is that comedians are totally cool with riffing on each other, but aren't really down with people from outside the comedy community doing it. As for your 'sources', the panelists on a roast are almost always comedians and are usually friends of the subject.

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I find it extremely funny, not in a malicious way, whenever Matt guesses something wrong. Be it the author of Trainspotting, a song, or video games, especially if it's followed up with "Let cut that, Brett." Phenomenal episode. What are the odds of getting all of the UCB 4 together for episode 100?

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Just because someone disliked Freak Dance doesn't mean they're not a Besser fan.

 

You didn't insult Freak Dance. You insulted Matt's ability to make a dance movie. You weren't ripping on the movie, you were disrespecting a person.

 

I figured you, as a sumptuously accomplished comedian, should be able to take a little ribbing about your old projects in stride. Shall I cite my sources? I only have one and it's wikipedia, but I think it helps my case: http://en.wikipedia..../Roast_(comedy)

 

Roast comedy isn't synonymous with contempt, nor does it happen in a medium that makes it difficult to detect any level of sarcasm. It also takes place in a relatively 'safe' environment and is performed by people with respect for the person being roasted.

 

In addition to that, roast comedy isn't a one-way street. The person being roasted gives consent. They agree to it. Without that consent, it's more insult than entertainment.

 

It's also good to note that in order for 'offensive comedy' to be successful, it has to be funnier than it is offensive.

 

What you are doing isn't 'roasting'. What you are doing is 'being insulting'.

 

Does that help you to understand?

 

What's your thinking on why it's not cool to flippantly insult Freak Dance?

 

What you think you said: "I don't like Freak Dance."

 

What you actually said: "Matt doesn't know how to make a watchable dance movie."

 

Does that clear it up for you? Again, you weren't insulting a movie. You were insulting a person for creating something.

 

Is it because I know you read the forum and should spare your feelings? Or is it because you've had me on the show and I should consider you a friendly acquaintance?

 

How about "Is it because as a fan of a person I should respect that person's work enough to express my opinions on the pieces of his work I didn't like in a way that isn't condescending, mean, and disrespectful?"

 

And now for a shitload of misdirection -

 

Your body of work isn't like the old testament of the bible, I can pick and choose what I accept in my heart and still expect to be let into improv heaven. So, to someone interested in preventing a torturous eternity, I wouldn't recommend either lying with a man as with a woman or watching Freak Dance.

 

You know what? You're right. Yeah, I really regret it and would delete it now if I knew that doing so wouldn't make you call me out as a fool and a coward. I'm completely backpedaling, okay? You win sir. Please don't intellectually bully me any farther, I've had enough. Let's talk sports sometime.

 

tl;dr - Be accountable for the things you say.

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What surprises me the most is not how dickish people can be, but how SHOCKED they are when they're called out for being a dick. Like BagguhMcGuirk said it's the same in the Comedy Bang Bang boards (and probably other boards here too), people feel the need t be unnecessarily snarky, and then play the victim like "Oh gee, I guess you can't have an opinion around here!" Sure you can have an opinion around here, even a negative one, but if you're being a dick people are going to tell you you're being a dick, and that shouldn't surprise you.

 

I saw some vicious road rage yesterday, two dudes in their SUVs cursing at each other and threatening to beat the shit out of each other. I think the internet is the same way. Being in tons of steel emboldens people, and turns them into psycopaths in trivial situations. Being on the internet, where you know nobody can hurt you and there are next to no serious consequences for the way you treat people emboldens people to talk to anyone however they want with complete disregard for how that person may feel about it.

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I have to say I find it completely fascinates me how some people listen to the show but seem to hate me. Does anyone have a theory? Seriously.

 

Matt I think it's a combination of you being really accessible and willing to engage with people, plus seeming to have an acerbic personality that makes them feel you're open season. Your honest and take a hard stance on the things that you think are wrong, I think people who attack you have a "if you can dish it out" mentality. If you weren't so frequently speaking your mind I'd think there'd be less hate. That's not a suggestion, because I don't think you should ever stop standing up for things and doing it on your podcast, that's just my assessment of the doo-doo-heads who go after you with unnecessary snark.

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On yesterday's podcast Matt Besser said something to the effect of, "I'm not successful enough to take this kind of criticism without being really insulted." I don't know if that was recorded before or after my comment, but it still made me feel bad for exacerbating Besser's body of work image issues. So, I'll actually backpedal on my original statement a bit here to clear my conscience.

 

I deliberately attacked Freak Dance as a dance movie, because as a musical dance movie, it was a failure. The music, lyrics and choreography were not up to any standards. A good satire needs to at least approach the quality of the genre it satirizes. As a surreal comedy movie it was great, clocking in at about a laugh a minute. However, the plodding, boring dance sequences make it impossible to recommend. So, my hate of Freak Dance leaves my respect for Matt as a comedian unscathed.

 

 

You didn't insult Freak Dance. You insulted Matt's ability to make a dance movie. You weren't ripping on the movie, you were disrespecting a person.

 

 

That statement is idiotic. How could one insult a person's only dance movie without insulting their demonstrated ability to make dance movies? Also, if you're going to split hairs like an idiot, I never insulted his abilities I only insulted his knowledge on how to make a watchable dance movie, which doesn't infringe on his character at all. Did you notice how I never called you an idiot? Is it really any better to beat around the bush like that? You still idiotically feel as if I called you an idiot.

 

Matt I think it's a combination of you being really accessible and willing to engage with people, plus seeming to have an acerbic personality that makes them feel you're open season. Your honest and take a hard stance on the things that you think are wrong, I think people who attack you have a "if you can dish it out" mentality. If you weren't so frequently speaking your mind I'd think there'd be less hate. That's not a suggestion, because I don't think you should ever stop standing up for things and doing it on your podcast, that's just my assessment of the doo-doo-heads who go after you with unnecessary snark.

 

If I were Matt, I would be most hurt that with all the people standing up for Matt and against "unnecessary snark" nobody is standing up for Freak Dance. Implicitly agreeing with me about Freak Dance while also agreeing with Matt's assessment of his career esteem not being able to withstand snark.

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That statement is idiotic. How could one insult a person's only dance movie without insulting their demonstrated ability to make dance movies?

 

"I think Freak Dance sucked."

 

Notice how that's pointed at the movie and takes Matt Besser as a person completely out of it? Let's compare it to...oh...say...

 

Matt knows almost as much about video games as he knows about making a watchable dance movie.

 

Here you're insulting a person - not a movie.

 

You can stick your fingers in your ears and hum all you want, but your point was clear.

 

Also, if you're going to split hairs like an idiot, I never insulted his abilities I only insulted his knowledge on how to make a watchable dance movie, which doesn't infringe on his character at all.

 

Oh, you don't know what 'ability' means. Sorry - usually when people defend a point it means they're smart.*

 

Did you notice how I never called you an idiot? Is it really any better to beat around the bush like that? You still idiotically feel as if I called you an idiot.

 

*Yeah! Let's hide behind a thin veil of comparatives to insult each other so that we can argue semantics and people will pay attention to us!

 

I'm beginning to understand your deal now. You're like an idiot with a flapping jaw that has a platform on which to make fun of people and then rescind accountability on the grounds that what-you-said-wasn't-actually-what-you-said-so-I'm-smarter-than-you-omg-please-pay-attention-to-me.

 

HAHA NOTICE HOW I DIDN'T CALL YOU ALL OF THOSE THINGS I JUST CALLED YOU BUT YOUR FEELINGS ARE STILL HURT?!

 

Just be a real person and stop trying to show the internet how smart and witty you are.

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You're missing Matt's point completely vgfitzger. You insulting Freak Dance had nothing to do with what you were talking about and everything to do with you wanting to be a dick. There was no reason for you to bring up Freak Dance when saying he knows nothing about video games, you just wanted to let him know you didn't like his movie, which is a total dick move.

 

As far as people not defending Freak Dance, it wasn't that you didn't like the movie that was a dick move, it's that you threw it in when it had nothing to do with what you were talking about. That's why nobody is defending the movie, because it's not that you didn't like it, it's the fact you felt the need to tell Matt you didn't like it just to be a dick.

 

I personally didn't bring it up because I feel it can sound a little kiss-assy to not only agree with him but then also say I loved the movie. But, since you're making a point of it, I did enjoy the movie. It took me a little while to really get into it, but about a quarter of the way in I really started to dig it.

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I liked freakdance. Freakdance is definitely better than most dance movies. You've seen step up right? That's an un-watchable dance movie. At least there's intentional, crafted material in freakdance. Just a thought...

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If I were Matt, I would be most hurt that with all the people standing up for Matt and against "unnecessary snark" nobody is standing up for Freak Dance. Implicitly agreeing with me about Freak Dance while also agreeing with Matt's assessment of his career esteem not being able to withstand snark.

 

Why are you still trying to illicit a conversation about Freakdance? Nobody asked you how you felt about Freakdance. Nobody cares how you feel about Freakdance. Freakdance was not a topic of discussion. Just because you feel like talking about how much you hate Freakdance doesn't mean anybody is obligated to indulge in your bullshit discussion. That's the conversation YOU want to have, Freakdance is not the pressing issue here though, the pressing issue is why is some dude being an asshole for no good reason.

 

Can you understand how you're being an asshole? You came here and out of the blue took an unprovoked jab at something someone put work into and is proud off. Can you not see how that is an extremely dickish thing to do? Honestly, when else is that kind of behavior acceptable or even defensible? Seriously, what kind of shit is that? Who raised you?

 

Serious question, do you have some kind of neurological disorder? Because autism seems like the only GOOD explanation for your actions, this would all make sense if you just have trouble understanding how to interact with people.

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Am I just gonna have to start closing threads where no one can get along?

 

If so, y'all should say goodbye to the "Yo! Is This Racist?" forum all together.

 

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it's so weird that this is the catchment guy. it sounds just like bored, lazy trolling to me. it's like "fuck it, i'm just gonna be as obnoxious as possible". that's always kinda sad

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it's so weird that this is the catchment guy. it sounds just like bored, lazy trolling to me. it's like "fuck it, i'm just gonna be as obnoxious as possible". that's always kinda sad

 

This is exactly it.

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Wow. I just came back from vacation and went to check out the comments on this great episode to find this ridiculous conversation. Seriously, just appreciate what Matt and the rest of the Earwolf team does for you in simply entertaining you for free. I, for one, do.

 

PS, Freak Dance kicks ass.

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