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Episode 217 - Jaws 3-D

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20 hours ago, Cameron H. said:

I think that it's kind of bullshit that when we first meet Quaid's character he's being a piece of crap by denying his employees any overtime to take care of a legitimate security emergency. Shelby Overman, the hunky, mustachioed beefcake who becomes baby Jaws' first victim, dies padlocking an underwater gate all by himself, sans scuba gear, working at night, without even the promise of time and a half. That's some fucking horse shit. American workers deserve fair wages for an honest day's work! 

(Speaking of Quaid as a shitty boss, there was also a small moment that made me crack up. I'm not sure if I can do it justice here, but I just wanted to share. In the scene where he and his men are trying to put together something to fix the underwater tunnel, as he is speaking to his girlfriend, he breaks off their conversation to yell to another employee "Watch how you're cutting that! It's critical!" The thing is, it's not really clear who he's even talking to and none of the extras respond to him, so the whole effect makes him look like a crazy person. I don't know, I just found it kind of hilarious. It felt like Quaid was improvising, but no one was bothering to yes/and him.)        

The fact that he's not willing to give it out willy nilly just further proves my case against Shelby. He wasn't denying his men overtime he was denying Shelby overtime. When asked if they can get it done Shelby's response was "for overtime maybe." Not "Yes, but we'll have to workovertime" or something compromising. Rather an ultimatum of overtime or nothing. To which Dennis Quaid responses "You've got enough overtime." I read this as he's a good boss who's been helping out his alcoholic employee by floating him overtime now and again. He can't afford to give him anymore overtime. Why does this diver maintenance crew have so much overtime to begin with? Because Mike Brody is a nice guy and been helping them out. Shelby has taken advantage of this and is now abusing it like he is abusing alcohol and Mike is trying his best to help. If he just keeps giving out overtime eventually Calvin will clamp down on it, and there will be no overtime for anyone!

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5 minutes ago, Cameron H. said:

I think they're just dividers. There's a logo on one that says, "PrivaSEA." Guests can probably rent them or something to separate themselves from the riff raff. 

(Incidentally, I was checking this on my lap top while sitting next to my wife. The whole scene is pretty dimly and the logo lit right behind Lea Thompson as she's removing her clothes. I had to pause the shot to read the logo and now I'm being accused of "perving out." Thanks, man.)

"I'm just trying to read the logo" the classic excuse of the man caught staring.

(Also, I'm very sorry. Mrs. H, your husband is a stand up guy and was trying to help a poor confused man. He only has eyes for you.... and Ryan Kwanten)

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7 minutes ago, Cam Bert said:

He only has eyes for you.... and Ryan Kwanten

Oh, she's well aware of this.

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There were a few things that bothered me about the initial hunt for Baby Shark. First of all, I had a real issue with them hunting for the shark at night. I really didn’t feel like that was a fantastic idea. It's a fenced in lagoon. It's not like it's going anywhere. Also, according to the website Sharks-World, Great Whites are active both day and night, so it wasn't like this was a particularly strategic time of day to go after it. The only argument I could think of was that they didn't want to have to shut down the park to hunt for it during the day, but then I remembered that this was all occurring during a special Preview week and the park was only open to "friends and family." So, it's not like the park would be losing any money if it shut down for a couple of hours to take care of a legitimate safety concern. In fact, you could say ironing out the parks kinks - like maybe taking care of a ten foot Murder shark - is precisely the reason to have a Preview week in the first place.

Another thing that bothered me is when one of the the people on the boat is handing Dr Kathryn the tranquilizer to subdue the shark, he tells her that the dosage is a "guesstimate." Motherfucker, I'm about to swim around in the dark looking forward baby shark that wants me dead. Don't give me your bull shit portmanteaus! I want real science delivered to me like a goddamn professional! 

Finally, did anyone else notice that Mike pushes Kathryn into the water by fully face palming her? Look, I'm scared. I don't know if I'm going to come back from this or not (she nearly doesn't). I don't know if the last thing I want to remember about my S.O. before I die is the thought of their shit eating grin as they shove their hand in my face and push me into an inky black lagoon of death. I mean, maybe he's just trying to keep it loose, but given the situation, I'm sure an "I love you, be careful" wouldn't have been totally unwelcome.     

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2 hours ago, Cam Bert said:

The fact that he's not willing to give it out willy nilly just further proves my case against Shelby. He wasn't denying his men overtime he was denying Shelby overtime. When asked if they can get it done Shelby's response was "for overtime maybe." Not "Yes, but we'll have to workovertime" or something compromising. Rather an ultimatum of overtime or nothing. To which Dennis Quaid responses "You've got enough overtime." I read this as he's a good boss who's been helping out his alcoholic employee by floating him overtime now and again. He can't afford to give him anymore overtime. Why does this diver maintenance crew have so much overtime to begin with? Because Mike Brody is a nice guy and been helping them out. Shelby has taken advantage of this and is now abusing it like he is abusing alcohol and Mike is trying his best to help. If he just keeps giving out overtime eventually Calvin will clamp down on it, and there will be no overtime for anyone!

HARD DISAGREE! First of all, if Mike is keeping incompetent employees on the payroll just to be “cool,” I’d argue that makes him a pretty shitty boss. How is it fair to any of his other employees if they’re constantly being asked to pick up Overman’s slack or fix his fuck ups? That kind of buddy-buddy managerial style breeds low morale. A manager should lead by example and rewards should be allotted based on merit and ability. And regardless, there doesn’t appear to be an real evidence to suggest that Overman isn’t good at his job. Had a dumbass, 1,200 lbs baby shark not head butted it’s stupid face into his fence, it would have worked flawlessly. It’s not his fault for failing to predict such a ridiculous thing might occur - especially considering Great Whites aren’t native to Florida.

Secondly, if you relisten to the overtime scene, you can hear the other employees cheer when he asks for it and groan when it’s denied. I think it’s pretty clear that the overtime request wasn’t just for him. Overman was just looking out for his buddies. And what does he do when he realizes his co-workers won’t make any extra bank? He stays late to get the job done BY HIMSELF. And what does he get for all his trouble? No overtime. No glory. He just gets eaten by a fake ass shark and posthumously accused of being an incompetent and a drunk by his former friend and boss. We should all be so lucky to work with a man like Overman.

Overman: Hero of the Working Class!

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31 minutes ago, Cameron H. said:

HARD DISAGREE! First of all, if Mike is keeping incompetent employees on the payroll just to be “cool,” I’d argue that makes him a pretty shitty boss. How is it fair to any of his other employees if they’re constantly being asked to pick up Overman’s slack or fix his fuck ups? That kind of buddy-buddy managerial style breeds low morale. A manager should lead by example and rewards should be allotted based on merit and ability. And regardless, there doesn’t appear to be an real evidence to suggest that Overman isn’t good at his job. Had a dumbass, 1,200 lbs baby shark not head butted it’s stupid face into his fence, it would have worked flawlessly. It’s not his fault for failing to predict such a ridiculous thing might occur - especially considering Great Whites aren’t native to Florida.

Secondly, if you relisten to the overtime scene, you can hear the other employees cheer when he asks for it and groan when it’s denied. I think it’s pretty clear that the overtime request wasn’t just for him. Overman was just looking out for his buddies. And what does he do when he realizes his co-workers won’t make any extra bank? He stays late to get the job done BY HIMSELF. And what does he get for all his trouble? No overtime. No glory. He just gets eaten by a fake ass shark and posthumously accused of being an incompetent and drunk by his former friend and boss. We should all be so luck to work with a man like Overman.

Overman: Hero of the Working Class!

First off, I think Mike walks that fine line between hard boss and cool boss. When the problem is first discovered, what is the diving crew's reaction? "Mike is going to be pissed." They are in fear off him because he can make their life hell and maybe he has already. He's been cool with the overtime in the past, but he's not such a cool guy boss that he's just going to jump when his employees say how high. I think he's a fair and even boss. He brings down the hammer when he needs to and rewards them when he can. If anything he's been a bit too helpful with Overman.

Overman is good at his job. I'll give you that. I mean he does his work and does it well. How else to explain that physic with his 5 bottles of Jim Beam habit he has going on. In fact he's such a good worker that's why Mike has keep him on despite his dependency on alcohol. He knows he's a good worker, but he's also the kind of guy that's looking to get as much as he can for the bare minimum. Of course everybody is going to be happy to get overtime pay, and upset when they don't. However, how many times has Overman done this? He's trying to be the hero among the crew. "He guys, I'm fighting for us" yet it is purely a selfish move that just happens to effect the others.

When it comes down to it we have to ask the question why was Overman killed. Here's what we know. He and his co-workers affixed the padlock on the gate and knocked off at a regular time. We know this because the gate was already padlocked when Overman went down at night. The rest of the team, and even Mike, are having laughs in the local bar. Where is Overman? Doing a lone dive at night. That's against rules and regulations and frankly just a bad idea. He's also doing it without company diving equipment, just his own snorkel. Why did he tell nobody about this? Why is he not using company equipment? Because he's trying to keep it a secret. What's the harm in telling his girlfriend or co-worker "I don't feel good about that lock, I'm going to have a second look." No, he told no one and broke the rules. This is either because he feared incompetence in his previous work and didn't want the blame or he's trying to sabotage work in order to force yet again more overtime work. His own selfish desires led to him sneaking off at night and ultimately becoming baby shark food.

Overman: Selfish alcoholic!

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30 minutes ago, Cam Bert said:

First off, I think Mike walks that fine line between hard boss and cool boss. When the problem is first discovered, what is the diving crew's reaction? "Mike is going to be pissed." They are in fear off him because he can make their life hell and maybe he has already. He's been cool with the overtime in the past, but he's not such a cool guy boss that he's just going to jump when his employees say how high. I think he's a fair and even boss. He brings down the hammer when he needs to and rewards them when he can. If anything he's been a bit too helpful with Overman.

Overman is good at his job. I'll give you that. I mean he does his work and does it well. How else to explain that physic with his 5 bottles of Jim Beam habit he has going on. In fact he's such a good worker that's why Mike has keep him on despite his dependency on alcohol. He knows he's a good worker, but he's also the kind of guy that's looking to get as much as he can for the bare minimum. Of course everybody is going to be happy to get overtime pay, and upset when they don't. However, how many times has Overman done this? He's trying to be the hero among the crew. "He guys, I'm fighting for us" yet it is purely a selfish move that just happens to effect the others.

When it comes down to it we have to ask the question why was Overman killed. Here's what we know. He and his co-workers affixed the padlock on the gate and knocked off at a regular time. We know this because the gate was already padlocked when Overman went down at night. The rest of the team, and even Mike, are having laughs in the local bar. Where is Overman? Doing a lone dive at night. That's against rules and regulations and frankly just a bad idea. He's also doing it without company diving equipment, just his own snorkel. Why did he tell nobody about this? Why is he not using company equipment? Because he's trying to keep it a secret. What's the harm in telling his girlfriend or co-worker "I don't feel good about that lock, I'm going to have a second look." No, he told no one and broke the rules. This is either because he feared incompetence in his previous work and didn't want the blame or he's trying to sabotage work in order to force yet again more overtime work. His own selfish desires led to him sneaking off at night and ultimately becoming baby shark food.

Overman: Selfish alcoholic!

You keep accusing Overman of being an alcoholic, but by your own admission, he was the only person NOT at the bar! If he was so incompetent and crippling in his addiction, why didn’t he cut out with everyone else? That certainly doesn’t sound like the actions of a person doing the “bare minimum” to me. No, instead Overman was out there securing the perimeter, on his own dime and with his own shitty equipment, just to make doubly sure it was done right.

Yes, he might have been bending the rules, but if in 1773 the Sons of Liberty didn’t break the “rules and regulations” of Great Britain and throw that tea into Boston Harbor, Americans would be eating Welsh rabbit and spotted dicks to this day. Sometimes, for the greater good, we’ve got to break the rules.

I mean, as long as we’re questioning people’s work ethic, why was Mike out drinking instead of making sure the incredibly important job he had assigned for his crew got done? It seems to me like the only person at Sea World doing their goddamn job was Overman...

Overman: American Patriot

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Say what you will about Millennials and our attention spans, but I'm pretty sure that we can enjoy watching fancy water skiing without also having Bavarian folk dancing and clowns rolling around in mud pits in the foreground. I honestly have no idea what type of show the guests were supposed to be watching. 

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5 hours ago, Cameron H. said:

You keep accusing Overman of being an alcoholic, but by your own admission, he was the only person NOT at the bar! If he was so incompetent and crippling in his addiction, why didn’t he cut out with everyone else? That certainly doesn’t sound like the actions of a person doing the “bare minimum” to me. No, instead Overman was out there securing the perimeter, on his own dime and with his own shitty equipment, just to make doubly sure it was done right.

Yes, he might have been bending the rules, but if in 1773 the Sons of Liberty didn’t break the “rules and regulations” of Great Britain and throw that tea into Boston Harbor, Americans would be eating Welsh rabbit and spotted dicks to this day. Sometimes, for the greater good, we’ve got to break the rules.

I mean, as long as we’re questioning people’s work ethic, why was Mike out drinking instead of making sure the incredibly important job he had assigned for his crew got done? It seems to me like the only person at Sea World doing their goddamn job was Overman...

Overman: American Patriot

Sure he may not have been at the bar but that didn't stop all the people at the bar the next day assuming he was hungover and drunk. If everybody knew for a fact he was not at the bar all not why would their first reaction be "Oh he's drunk!" Easy, because he doesn't drink at the bar he drinks alone! You have cool boss Mike offering to get drinks for everybody in lieu of overtime, and yet where is Overman the man that wanted overtime the most? He's not getting drunk with his co-works he's doing secret work. Maybe he started the party early which lead to him rashly diving alone.

No, I maintain that he's covering up his drinking habits. I mean you can smell booze on people, know when somebody is phoning in "sick" or working through a hang over. Mike has seen it all. Yet he keeps Overman on. If his work is good, what cause would he have. If he was at the bar drinking all the time then he's clearly a drunk and something has to be done. If he's drinking at home alone or on the beach, who knows what he's up. It's just hearsay. He's a closeted drinker.

What else might he be in the closet about though? He seems like a Lothario waving at the skiing girls, hitting on female co-works, etc. but what if this is all a ruse? Is he trying to cover up more than just his drinking. What if Overman is struggling to accept who he is and his sexuality. It's the early 80s, it's Reagan's America. He's afraid to live his truth do to socials pressures and stigmas. He just wants to live a happy life as an out gay male. He hides this do to perceived social pressures. He over compensates for it by hitting on all women. Denying his true self and his true feelings drive him to drink. This leads to guilt and shame. Then the cycle repeats. He's a man who's being denied the chance to live his truth and before he can muster up the courage and conviction to do so he's cut down in his prime but a hastily made shark puppet. Wow.

Overman: Tragic hero?

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5 hours ago, Cameron H. said:

You keep accusing Overman of being an alcoholic, but by your own admission, he was the only person NOT at the bar! If he was so incompetent and crippling in his addiction, why didn’t he cut out with everyone else? That certainly doesn’t sound like the actions of a person doing the “bare minimum” to me. No, instead Overman was out there securing the perimeter, on his own dime and with his own shitty equipment, just to make doubly sure it was done right.

Yes, he might have been bending the rules, but if in 1773 the Sons of Liberty didn’t break the “rules and regulations” of Great Britain and throw that tea into Boston Harbor, Americans would be eating Welsh rabbit and spotted dicks to this day. Sometimes, for the greater good, we’ve got to break the rules.

I mean, as long as we’re questioning people’s work ethic, why was Mike out drinking instead of making sure the incredibly important job he had assigned for his crew got done? It seems to me like the only person at Sea World doing their goddamn job was Overman...

Overman: American Patriot

I think he's a private alcoholic who is known to be an alcoholic and as such is trying to hide his drinking. He reminds me a lot of my mom's ex boyfriend . Both LOOK healthy and clean cut but are secretly pouring vodka in their Gatorade.  He's a  relapsed semi functional alcoholic whose rapidly losing the functional part of his title.

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Surely this Seaworld is awash in OSHA regulation issues right? In 2010 they fined Seaworld Of Florida LLC $75,000 for three safety violations " including one classified as willful, following the death of an animal trainer in February". 

"SeaWorld recognized the inherent risk of allowing trainers to interact with potentially dangerous animals," said Cindy Coe, OSHA's regional administrator in Atlanta, Ga. "Nonetheless, it required its employees to work within the pool walls, on ledges and on shelves where they were subject to dangerous behavior by the animals."
 

The article I read goes on to talk about how the investigation turned up several instances throughout multiple facilities of many unexpected and possibly dangerous interactions with orcas. Honestly if you switch out Great White Shark with Orca you have this movie! 

https://www.osha.gov/news/newsreleases/national/08232010-0

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I found this while searching for more images of Shelby Overman: Folk Hero.

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTIBVNo9-tq7bZHx8VMA0x 

Topps apparently released trading cards for this movie and it’s maybe the dumbest thing I’ve ever seen.

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This is what I found when I was trying to look up information on Harry Grant, a.k.a Shelby Overman: Flawed Soul.

Apparently he wrote and directed a movie after Jaws 3 called Flex. Here's the plot summary:

A bodybuilding film starring Harry Grant and Tom Platz. Grant was Mr. Los Angeles and Mr. Southern California, Platz was a Mr. Universe title-holder. Grant plays Vince, personal trainer at a gym in San Diego who wants to open his own gym. To get the money, Vince dates a rich heiress, but gets caught by his former fiancee. Vince's plans for a new gym take a downturn from there, being exposed by all related.

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1 hour ago, Cameron H. said:

I found this while searching for more images of Shelby Overman: Folk Hero.

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTIBVNo9-tq7bZHx8VMA0x 

Topps apparently released trading cards for this movie and it’s maybe the dumbest thing I’ve ever seen.

87059-6282018Fr.jpg

The card every kid wanted, the "lover's smooch."

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24 minutes ago, Cam Bert said:

87059-6282018Fr.jpg

The card every kid wanted, the "lover's smooch."

jaws-3d-2.jpg

I don’t know about no “shark monsters” but that sure is one monster of a spoiler.

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33 minutes ago, Cam Bert said:

87059-6282018Fr.jpg

The card every kid wanted, the "lover's smooch."

Is no one else concerned about the fact the dog looks like it's getting more familiar with Kathryn than Brody ? I feel UNCOMFORTABLE with this card

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2 minutes ago, TomPretty said:

Mike was kind of a dick.

Keegan-Michael-Key-Thank-you.gif

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blog_jaws3d5.jpg?12262

The best thing about the card above (besides ANOTHER massive spoiler), is that as Mike is descending those stairs he asks the man in the brown shirt, “Did they pull him out?” No Mike, there’s another corpse covered with a bloody sheet laying atop this gurney right in front of your dumb face. 

Mike is such a dip shit...

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When you guys were discussing soap operas and mentioned Michael Knight, and specified the actor not the Hasselhoff character, I was reminded that after Catherine Hickland divorced David Hasselhoff she married Michael Knight.  Just a random fact that was dislodged from my brain by the episode.

 

Also saw this film in the theater when I was ten.  I remember thinking the shark blowing up in 3D was the coolest thing ever, with parts of everything it ate during the film flying off the screen. 

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When Mike is identifying Shelby’s body, there is a sign on the back wall (you can see it in the trading card image that Cameron H. posted).

The sign says “AUTHORIZED PERSONNEL ONLY:  No one will enter this work area without explicit permission of aquarium department, in that it directly effects the well-being and behavior of the sharks”.

First of all, they just captured that baby shark no more than a day ago (seemingly).  It seems odd that they would have had time to make up a sign already.

Secondly, “well-being and behavior of the sharks”?  Sharks plural?  Seeing Shelby’s body is their first indication that there might be more than one shark so this sign makes no sense.

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I freely admit that I ate an edible before I watched this movie. Was it just a pot-induced hallucination, or did dolphins save Dennis Quaid and his girlfriend at one point?

 

Loved all the digressions in this episode, by the way.

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the Soap Talk on the episode made me wonder did anyone else watch soap operas while they were younger and if so what was your "Soap"  and who introduced you to it?  I got into them when I was around 12 because my mom was working and that summer I was allowed to stay home alone but if I wanted to swim my neighbor would have to come over to supervise. She was a Young and The Restless and Bold and the Beautiful fan so I got into it pretty quickly. I also remember occasionally catching Melrose Place in syndication. I think I stopped watching by the time I was 15 or 16. 

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10 hours ago, DrGuts1003 said:

When Mike is identifying Shelby’s body, there is a sign on the back wall (you can see it in the trading card image that Cameron H. posted).

The sign says “AUTHORIZED PERSONNEL ONLY:  No one will enter this work area without explicit permission of aquarium department, in that it directly effects the well-being and behavior of the sharks”.

First of all, they just captured that baby shark no more than a day ago (seemingly).  It seems odd that they would have had time to make up a sign already.

Secondly, “well-being and behavior of the sharks”?  Sharks plural?  Seeing Shelby’s body is their first indication that there might be more than one shark so this sign makes no sense.

They did manage to get a sign made to advertise that the baby shark was on display. Granted, it was a stencil and spray-painted sign, but someone got it done. My guess is that Danny made it. That guy did everything.

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I found it odd that we do not get much closure on several of the film’s characters (unless I just wasn’t paying close enough attention).

Does Louis Gossett Jr. live?  Last I recall seeing of him was when he was swimming to safety after the shark crashed through the control room.

And why no final scene involving the other Brody son?  Last we saw of him was going with Lea Thomson to the hospital.  Did she survive her injuries?  Why not give us a scene of the Brody boys at the hospital commenting on how this keeps happening to them?  (And then have a shark dressed in a doctor’s coat try to attack them again)

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