EPISODE #223 - Disclosure (1994)

[Cameron H. 23786]

10 minutes ago, grudlian. said:

I really hope this is site wide and a bunch of people never see this thread. They'll always wonder "why is hedgehog a reaction?"

This comment deserves a hedgehog! (I think I might be overusing the hedgehog)

[AlmostAGhost 2718]

15 hours ago, Cameron H. said:

So, what do you all think happens after the credits roll?

here's my prediction: white rich guys keep getting richer and keep spanking their secretaries, nothing changes

[DanEngler 5249]

42 minutes ago, grudlian. said:

I really hope this is site wide and a bunch of people never see this thread. They'll always wonder "why is hedgehog a reaction?"

They should be available everywhere. I'm honestly torn between wanting to use the hedgehog for its intended purpose and ONLY using hedgehogs from now on.

[Cameron H. 23786]

7 minutes ago, DanEngler said:

They should be available everywhere. I'm honestly torn between wanting to use the hedgehog for its intended purpose and ONLY using hedgehogs from now on.

Hedgehogs forever!!!

[Rimmer 8]

Jason got it right on the Prozac gaffe. You need to take that shit daily for 4 to 6 weeks before it takes full effect, and popping a single Prozac would have negligible effect. But the really crazy thing about that mistake being in this particular movie is that Michael Crichton is a fucking doctor. If that's how he thinks Prozac works, I'm glad his books kept him away from the hospitals.

[NotTeamLamb 7]

45 minutes ago, Rimmer said:

Jason got it right on the Prozac gaffe. You need to take that shit daily for 4 to 6 weeks before it takes full effect, and popping a single Prozac would have negligible effect. But the really crazy thing about that mistake being in this particular movie is that Michael Crichton is a fucking doctor. If that's how he thinks Prozac works, I'm glad his books kept him away from the hospitals.

I’m pretty convinced this wasn’t a scripted line and rather something Miller added himself. I happened to be watching Bordello of Blood recently and he delivers a very similar line. After a quick Google search I found countless references to Prozac in his stand-up and books. It was the 90’s... I’m sure he thought it was a very topical and didn’t mind retreading the same material. 

[GrahamS. 803]

Thanks to everyone who shared and everyone who supported. 

Also, I have to say @DanEngler,that was a fucking awesome Spike Jonze video! Since I’m a big fan of his, thought I’d add to the lighter side of things again and create a mini playlist.

Here’s Bjork dancing:

 

[GrahamS. 803]

5 hours ago, Cameron H. said:

Hedgehogs forever!!!

Agreed!

Here’s Spike himself dancing

Here’s the Beastie Boys beastie-ing (i’ll Just make up words here)

And here’s Sofia Coppola doing gymnastics:

 

[sycasey 2.0 2301]

21 hours ago, Cameron H. said:

So, what do you all think happens after the credits roll? The movie frames it as a happy ending, and I suppose there is some measure of vindication at the end for Douglas’ character, but ultimately he still works for a company whose Machiavellian CEO and corporate toady sidekicks were more than willing to frame and fire him for incompetence over an allegation that they knew to be false. They clearly preferred Demi for the job, who wasn’t fired so much for what she did, but because she was publicly caught. 

Why should Douglas think for even a second that there won’t be further retaliation? And even if he made such a good impression at the shareholders’ meeting that he’s effectively proved his worth and saved his job, why would he want to stay there? Fuck that place.  

Hah, that definitely occurred to me too. So his "happy ending" is that he gets to keep working at this company that has been trying to undermine him and screw him behind his back. Congratulations?

I guess you could argue they'll leave him alone now since he's shown that he can play the game just as well.

[sycasey 2.0 2301]

Another thing I found odd is that Meredith called Tom's wife to tell her the next morning's meeting is at 8:30, but then we learn the meeting is actually at 7:30 and Tom got screwed.

But realistically, what kind of attendance do you expect for a 7:30 AM meeting that you changed fairly late the night before (seems like it's around 9 or 10 PM when she calls)? And it's not just executives (who might all be in on the plan), it's a meeting where the technical guys have to be set up and ready to demonstrate a product! This seems like a bad move that is more likely to result in Meredith's meeting only having half the normal attendance at best, not just Tom being late.

[Cam Bert 8145]

10 hours ago, sycasey 2.0 said:

Another thing I found odd is that Meredith called Tom's wife to tell her the next morning's meeting is at 8:30, but then we learn the meeting is actually at 7:30 and Tom got screwed.

But realistically, what kind of attendance do you expect for a 7:30 AM meeting that you changed fairly late the night before (seems like it's around 9 or 10 PM when she calls)? And it's not just executives (who might all be in on the plan), it's a meeting where the technical guys have to be set up and ready to demonstrate a product! This seems like a bad move that is more likely to result in Meredith's meeting only having half the normal attendance at best, not just Tom being late.

I worry about the work ethic of somebody who is the head of a department that also just shows up just on time for a major cross department meeting as well. That is some classic tie-less boss behaviour.

[DrGuts1003 462]

23 hours ago, sycasey 2.0 said:

I guess you could argue they'll leave him alone now since he's shown that he can play the game just as well.

Actually he doesn’t play The Game until three years later.

[DrGuts1003 462]

12 hours ago, sycasey 2.0 said:

Another thing I found odd is that Meredith called Tom's wife to tell her the next morning's meeting is at 8:30, but then we learn the meeting is actually at 7:30 and Tom got screwed.

But realistically, what kind of attendance do you expect for a 7:30 AM meeting that you changed fairly late the night before (seems like it's around 9 or 10 PM when she calls)? And it's not just executives (who might all be in on the plan), it's a meeting where the technical guys have to be set up and ready to demonstrate a product! This seems like a bad move that is more likely to result in Meredith's meeting only having half the normal attendance at best, not just Tom being late.

I actually thought that phone call was going to play a key role in the mediation hearing.  Part of Demi Moore’s testimony to prove that Douglas harassed her was that she was so angry and upset after he left her office.  I figured Douglas’ lawyer would question why she would bother calling his house and tell him about the meeting time if she was so affected by what he had supposedly done to her.

[gigi-tastic 2322]

I go away for a few days to deal with a migraine and I come back to a friendly little buddy! I'm both delighted and worried about the extent I will abuse this new power. Look I'm doing it already. I hedgehog'ed my own post. His name is Gerald and I love him.

[gigi-tastic 2322]

Maybe it's just me but did any one else worry about people getting discombobulated and lost in the V.R world? I would very easily get confused by that many miles on miles of weird empty (definitely haunted) hallways and would "wander" around in confusion for who knows how long looking for the room for my file if I didn't "fall" to my death first.  Now that I think about it this would 100% give me motion sickness.

On the other hand what a great excuse to slack off from work "Sorry I'm late for this very boring and useless meeting! I got lost in the M. C Escher Hell Scape... Again " 

[Smigg. 509]

28 minutes ago, gigi-tastic said:

Maybe it's just me but did any one else worry about people getting discombobulated and lost in the V.R world? I would very easily get confused by that many miles on miles of weird empty (definitely haunted) hallways and would "wander" around in confusion for who knows how long looking for the room for my file if I didn't "fall" to my death first.  Now that I think about it this would 100% give me motion sickness.

On the other hand what a great excuse to slack off from work "Sorry I'm late for this very boring and useless meeting! I got lost in the M. C Escher Hell Scape... Again " 

Oddly enough, people do get "lost" when playing VR games, so in a situation like that, it could be pretty dangerous.
 

 

[gigi-tastic 2322]

On 9/30/2019 at 10:59 AM, taylorannephoto said:

@Smigg. & @GrahamS. I want to honestly thank the both of you for opening up to us all. I know personally how hard it is to even talk about this, but y'all are doing a good thing (much better than this fucking movie) and we're all here with y'all. My experiences with sexual assault and harassment started when I was just 11 years old, and has continued well into my 20s, so I seriously want to thank y'all for sharing today.

To make an incredibly dark subject light again because I'm sure none of us can deal without trying to make each other laugh I present this.

I just wanted to add I'm also really grateful that @Smigg., @GrahamS. and everyone else feels safe enough to talk about these things here and I'm so sorry so many of us have dealt with such bullshit. I want to say that my personal experience with sexual harassment and assault didn't really start until my 20s but I know that if I really though about it it probably went back much later. There are so many small things we condition ourselves to brush off that if we really let ourselves think about them aren't that small. They can be pretty big. 

My lighter note is that it's day two of my favorite week of the year: Fat Bear Week! Every year Katmai National Park has a contest on their Facebook page for the fattest bear in their park. I urge you all to head over for a truly wholesome and  bodacious time! I feel like maybe I should call in to let Paul know since he loves the Country Bears and these are also, technically, fat bears out in the country, but I worry that it's too late and he might not get the message this week. 

https://m.facebook.com/KatmaiNPP/?ref=m_notif&notif_t=feedback_reaction_generic

[Cockney Mackem 514]

On 9/27/2019 at 2:15 PM, Smigg. said:

After listening to the discussion about it. I might as well add my expriences as a teenager in the age of the "Adult Movie" laden 90s.

Back when I was at school, there was a bustling tape trading scene.  One kid would have "Sliver", and is willing to make a deal to get his hands on "9 1/2 Weeks".  There was the one kid who was trying to palm off "Naked Lunch", but nobody was gonna take that slop. The kid who had Basic Instinct was the hot hand.  If you had that, you can decide your own terms.  But, it was also great, because you weren't bringing porn into school, and because it's being taped off the TV, you just label it something like "WWF SuperStars", because who's getting in trouble for wrestling?

But, all that changed with the advent of a new network channel, Channel 5.  We only had BBC, ITV, and Channel 4, so getting your hands on tapes was much more difficult, because you had to scour the Radio Times, find something that could potentially be considered "dirty", programme it in, hope your mum and dad had gone to bed at that time, and then wake up earlier than everybody else to get the tape out before anybody could catch you, it's especially tricky if you have satellite.  There was a real risk/reward aspect to the operation, but, if you could pull it off, you've got a bargaining chip.

But then Channel 5 happened, and it just turned that shit on it's ear, because Channel 5 changed the game with the Friday Night Dirty Movie.  Or, as it was pronounced where I'm from "The Frahdee Nah't Detty FIlm".  With the Frahdee Nah't Detty Film becoming a staple in the listings, it basically collapsed the tape trading scene, because why would you wait around for someone to bring in a relatively tame Sharon Stone movie, when Shannon Tweed was on every Friday?  The market was flooded, and now there was no bargaining leverage.

And, what happens when an underworld market collapses?  A kingpin rises up, and this kid rose up because he had a TV in his room.  Not only did he have a TV in his room, he had a VCR... and Cable.  British cable channels were weird in the 90s, some of them would just become softcore channels at 10pm. We had this channel called L!VE TV, you ask any man who was a teenager in the 90s, that channel was stuff of legend. You had Grenada Men & Motors, cars in the day, dirty programming at night, whatever took your fancy, cable had it.  The market was back, but ruled by one kid.  It collapsed again because he got taken down when someone snitched on him to the teachers.

Those days were like the wild west, I still miss it a little.

One of my very few claims to fame is that I appeared on L!ve TV performing stand-up comedy, which was broadcast straight after the topless darts. My act had to be cleared by Legal before it could be broadcast.

[Cockney Mackem 514]

Obviously too late for the minisode and the very constructive posts by fellow users about the wider issue of sexual harassment and assault.

However, I read an interesting piece of trivia on IMDB that this was one of three major cinema releases in the early 90s to deal with the topic of sexual harassment. This one, which was about a woman being the harasser, Gross Misconduct which was about a woman falsifying a complaint, and Mamet's Oleanna which sort of showed both parties' sides of the story.

I think if people tried to get their information about the issue in real life from how it's portrayed in these films, they might get the wrong idea.

[theworstbuddhist 572]

49 minutes ago, Cockney Mackem said:

Obviously too late for the minisode and the very constructive posts by fellow users about the wider issue of sexual harassment and assault.

However, I read an interesting piece of trivia on IMDB that this was one of three major cinema releases in the early 90s to deal with the topic of sexual harassment. This one, which was about a woman being the harasser, Gross Misconduct which was about a woman falsifying a complaint, and Mamet's Oleanna which sort of showed both parties' sides of the story.

I think if people tried to get their information about the issue in real life from how it's portrayed in these films, they might get the wrong idea.

Ha. I was the male lead in Oleanna once. It was, I suppose, a progressive script at the time in that it got people to talk about the issue but it hasn't aged well. The young female student is "manipulated" into pressing charges against an arrogant young professor who feels entitled to the tenure he is expecting. It probably wouldn't go over any better now than Disclosure does, unless someone did it with a fringe-theatre spin (gender-blind casting, fetishwear costuming maybe).

Edited to clarify why I put "manipulated" in quotes there: my memory of the script is that Mamet doesn't give the young woman any real agency of her own, she is convinced to press charges by vengeful feminists or something, allowing the audience to have more sympathy for her. These days I hope the story could be done without such a device. There are certainly still things to enjoy about Mamet's work (especially his books about theatre, True or False and Three Uses of the Knife) but that play, enh, not so much.

[GrahamS. 803]

On a tangent, I finally finished watching this season of Big Mouth—Nick Kroll being the reason this film was chosen in the first place (or at least he’s given the credit). The Big Mouth episode where they made a musical of Disclosure was legitimately very funny, but I wish they hadn’t described so many of the jokes on the podcast. For me, it killed a lot of the surprise the episode would have had. They should have said that this movie had inspired them to make an episode about it and left it at that.

Also, I enjoyed this season of Big Mouth but I didn’t feel like it was quite as good as the others. I can’t quite figure out why. Maybe it’s hard to top David Thewlis, maybe I enjoyed the seasons that dealt with divorce and depression more (and especially the episode where the kids get high on the dad’s pot gummies). Don’t get me wrong—there definitely were stand-out episodes here. I think I just found this season less surprising and cohesive as a whole.

[DeathToMikeyBay 130]

This was one of the quaintest 90s movies ever. Erotic thriller, Dennis Miller, CD-ROMs, virtual reality (there was a big VR craze in the early 90s), PDAs with built in fax modems. 

Has no one brought up yet that this movie got not one, but TWO Bollywood remakes?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aitraaz

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shrimathi

 

There is no more awkward and dated sub-genre than the 90s erotic thriller. There's an obscure one that would totally make great HDTGM fodder: The Temp. Starring Timothy Hutton, Lara Flynn Boyle, Faye Dunaway, and Oliver Platt (who played a dweebish side character in every other movie from the early 80s & 90s). It is also about the Machiavellian maneuverings at a company...a COOKIE company. Imagine the powerful ACTING! scenes of Disclosure, only the topic is cookies instead of harassment and cd-roms. It features hilarious murders: dumb electrocutions, haywire office equipment, eating glass, and the one and only cinematic instance of Chekhov's wasp.