Threshold

Voting it in, but agreed with the clunky direction, editing and music. All of which I can probably put at the feet of being a mid-70's film. It's scattered with little blunders, particularly the sprinkling of horror. It rarely rocks up, then when it does, it's quite blatant. Almost like a stop-stop stop finally start. But the themes and script are just so good, and Paula Prentiss has a star-making turn. Voted yes

Top Gun, oh Jesus Christ, what a terrible terrible film. It's especially Infuriating since its shelf life is somehow viewed as immortal.

Both terrific films, but this Versus forces us to choose which is more effective at conveying a political (ethical) point. A fictional narrative with characters, or a fact-heavy documentary.

I'm so behind all the episodes This is a clumsily directed and written film- no way around it. It squanders its wonderful setup by keeping its focus away from any kind of tense plot developments. At its core, it's a accidental murder film; of which there are so many other films that have done this so much better- I'd wage even being out at the same time as this film. Hard no, not because I have anything against it; it's just a casual subpar film.

Sixteen Candles has been done- but I still maintain that the Ferris Bueller episode should be the episode Devin returns for (I have said this so many times on the forum)

I think that's an interesting angle to take. Can you truly be unbiased with films with heavily political aspects? I think that's near impossible personally. We as the audience have opinions, and we project onto the film. I really like Devin's phrase (which I will paraphrase) in an earlier episode (can't remember which one) Films either support the current cultural status-quo or it criticises it. This film creates a dichotomy between the two sexual female characters. With an anti-hero as our POV, it creates an interesting view of women which is pretty hard to ignore. In a more knowledgable modern time we know that Glenn Close's character is suffering from Borderline Personailty Disorder, and that makes the first half of the film a bit more empathetic on both characters. But yeah- then it devolves into a stalker thriller. It'd be very interesting to see it from the POV of her character. It's an interesting film- especially for the effect it had on the Single White Female films (genre?) but yeah, it's just standard. Easy, if interesting, 'No' vote.

I had to watch this in two sittings, it is almost purposely grating and unpleasant to watch as it can be, to the point where I stopped watching half an hour in. However, upon the second watch, after understanding the film's rhythm, it becomes more tolerable. I wouldn't recommend it by any stretch, and I still find barely anything of value in this, but it certainly is a unique voice. But yeah, I've voted a belated no. There's some interesting stuff there, but ultimately it's quite one-note in terms of the gags it's got in its arsenal.

If Devin is indeed coming back- he should come back to settle this argument OR do a belated Best of 2016 I Stand By it

Fully agreed- I immediately picked this up in the Ghostbusters episode- hoped it would be a one-off but then it appeared it may an Amy thing. No hate- after all the yellow scarf thing is her thing, but yeah she definitely needs someone to play the 'straight man' to her- it can't all be film criticism based around the love of the 'little things'. In saying that I can't offer any alternatives as I don't know enough critics who had 'Craft' centred conversations as Devin did.

Amy's bonkers obsession with La La Land has to be hashed out in an episode- bringing it up in a LOTR episode seems like a move when you've recently broken up with someone- where everything somehow relates back to the ex. I think David Chen swayed me when he brought up the score- Howard Shore's score is great in all 3 films, but it almost becomes transcendent in Return of the King: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNN1zF9wldU Overall: It should've been Individual LOTR film V The Trilogy; ah well.

Haven't listened to the episode yet, but considering Two Towers or the trilogy as a whole isn't included- this may be a bizarre Beginning VS ending battle, or even worse; which movie has the better 'scenes'. I suspect this ep will be a battle of semantics honestly.

I'll +1 any thought about this being light and forgettable- but it's also broad as hell, it's almost genetically manufactured to be as pleasant and unprovocative as it is. It's fine, nowhere near Canon material.

Well if we're allowing "Neither" as an option now, might as well allow "the trilogy" as a third option; although this might be me fuming over my favourite LOTR film, The Two Towers, being omitted. On the positive side, I love me some Joanna Robinson/David Chen action

Still would appreciate a belated Best of 2016 if Amy's up for it

Does the Canon even matter now that Whiplash has been voted out?

Yep yep yep yep yep 100% This paired with the fact "neither" is an option this poll is fucked. I'd vote for both of these films seperately but being forced to choose in this bizarro sophie's choice in ehich the ultimatum itself really makes no sense, I'd have to go with Whiplash- A tight film with multiple exceptional thematic throughlines. The editing, music, performances and direction are all laserfocused to create this unbelievably exciting film. Juno's a fun film that I would've voted for if not for this nonsense, but even then it's not Reitman's best.

Christ, David Ehlrich can be infuriating sometimes- particularly his recent Netflix article, but the combination of him being on the backfoot in this regard (defending a movie rather than attacking) and the fact he's a feisty dude, we may have a return to a canon episode that feels like a canon episode, rather than the 3 bizarre half-hearted polite debates we've had recently.

Well, I know Amy has already recorded a LOTR episode with my podcast guru Joanna Robinson- so there probably won't be a versus- but I absolutely agree with the idea that the making of is just as terrific as the films themselves. Yeah, that might be the main issue- they're all segmented, I'm not quite sure if there is one big documentary that's easily accessible without being split.

DUDE! not even joking- Maybe the next VS should be LOTR trilogy V the hours of The Making of footage.

The more I'm reading the discussions about Juno and Whiplash the more infuriated I am about them being pitted against each other. They are such different films with superficial connections to each other. I think for a VS episode there has to be certain caveats: Same director/screenwriter/actor/vibe or a nonsensical VS i.e Best of 2016 (which I would absolutely love an episode about (regardless of it being now 4ish months ago) I'm trying to compare and contrast these films but they are so different- this is one of the most bizarre pairings in a long time. I hope there's a both option on the voting; this is ridiculous, surely there was another Blacklist script that was similar to Whiplash OR Juno right?

Agreed- at this point it's just debating music and pitting your personal fav musician in rather than the film. I guess I'd go for David Byrne since I like his music better- but man I really think concert films are the equivalent of inducting DVD extras into the canon

That's interesting, because while Whiplash has a great script- it's not particularly flashy in the same way Juno is. The reason Whiplash works is due to the directing, editing, JK Simmons going above and beyond, and then the screenplay. Whereas Juno seems to be an almost exclusively screenplay-driven film.

So I haven't listened yet- but I checked out his twitter as I haven't heard about him before. It is so bizarre seeing such detailed critiques of LGBT representation in cinema mixed in with pro Trump tweets- I guess its the Caitlyn Jenner argument, in a truly tolerant "Post Gay" world, being gay doesn't mean your political beliefs have to align to the left. But anyway- this isn't an Armond White discussion, this is a Sign o the Times V Stop Making Sense, I haven't seen them yet, but it seems like either choice is decent.