WatchOutForSnakes

Aye. I've been trying to really find the right words on this one. I couldn't bring myself to re-watch it. I was too young to see it in theaters when it came out, but I remember watching it in school, and the one time one of the TV networks showed it in its entirety. It was my first real introduction to the holocaust and I hadn't known anyone who was Jewish until college. What stuck with me the most was not just the gruesome deaths, but Schindler's breaking down at the end about how many more people he could have saved. But it's been about 25 years since I've seen it and I'm still not quite ready to see it again. One thing I've been wanting to discuss is that I can't quite put my finger on whey Schindler's List became the introduction to the Jewish story and the Holocaust?

Is this a Zack Morris v AC Slater Holiday Rom-Com Death Match?

I thought the exact same thing!! I've seen Practical Magic more times than I can count, and that's where my mind went every time they mentioned it.

I was entirely considering the Leslie Ann Warren (1965) version of it for my pick! I watched that one sooooooo many times as a kid. I remember this came out when I was in high school. I think I saw it at the time, and I'm looking forward to revisiting it! p.s. the 1965 version is on Amazon Prime

First, @Cameron H. I'm deeply sorry for your loss.

Yes! The first time I watched Rocky, my first takeaway thought was, "I thought there'd be more boxing."

I agree. She definitely has a positive arc throughout the sequels.

Oh, I guarantee even if Rocky's motives were find (and I think they were) Adrienne definitely was not feeling comfortable with Rocky until after they were dating. Her reactions to him were pretty telling.

Oh I have all kinds of thoughts on how Adrienne is treated! Rocky's entire pursuit of Adrienne is all kinds of creepy. He is entirely unconcerned with who she is as Amy says he only talks about himself on the date. Going up to his house and pressuring her in and that whole scene was super uncomfortable. I never once felt she had any agency in the scene or in the movie. More than just it being 'the times' this was problematic.

I agree. The movie would have had a much bigger emotional impact if we got a chance to see the different ways she tried to make it in music before, and how much it was a part of her life. Here, it's just, "oh, I need to take singing lessons . . . again." When did she take them before? Was she actually better before? FFJ is a pretty rich story that either got left on the cutting room floor, or was never really introduced at all, despite its run time.

Also, in my reading up on the real Florence, she died following a heart attack that occurred in the weeks following her Carnegie Hall performance. My understanding is that the whole hiding of the newspapers bit and a bad review causing collapse, was all artistic license.

I agree that it lost my interest the first time around,and I didn't make it through in one sitting. Yesterday, I watched it all and found the second viewing more enjoyable. I was reading the Wiki pages for her, Sinclair, and Cosmo, and I watched some interviews with the actors, and I think there's a lot there that could have been told, but wasn't. The movie doesn't quite live up to the richness of her story. It drops a lot of one-liners about her history, like how her father cut her out of the will and he taught piano to make ends meet (also her bit about playing for the President is true). But it could have also dropped in that her father absolutely refused to let her perform, and once he died her mother was slightly more lenient but kept a tight seal on who could see her, so she really didn't get a chance to perform in public until she was in her 60's. I think all of that would have made her a much more sympathetic figure in the film. Because of her histtory, I think she knew she was untalented, but she kept her performances closed to basically just close friends and supporters. I imagine many people fawned and faked around her, not necessarily for access to her will, but for future endowments. I agree that the film has us laughing at her at first, but I didn't feel that way the second time I watched it. I did feel like I sympathized with her love for music and performing, and the people around her who arguably just wanted to let her live out her fantasies. One can argue whether it's better to keep Florence sheltered from the truth or whether it would be more kind to be honest. ETA: I really enjoyed Meryl in this.

When I first saw Clockwork, I didn't hate it or even view it with the same lens (hell, at that age I was shocked to learn women still earned less than men). I was introduced to it by a guy, theater major friend who was a huge Kubrick fan, and I do think he viewed it as art and not just bro-core. I do also consider it art. I just can't watch it anymore. There are just certain things I opt out of. I wrestle with the necessity of showing ultra-violence in the way Kubrick does. On the one hand, you can't show extreme violence in extremely shocking ways without, well, doing it. But is necessary to linger so long on things? Or to take it to such an extreme? I really don't have an answer for that. I see both AlmostAGhost and Cameron H's side. Does the artist's intention matter? If he intends the violence/sex as commentary, does it matter vs. whether he intends it as fantasy/male gaze? Also, I find Kubrick's treatment of the actors in this film really despicable.

I'm with Cameron H on ACO. I watched it in college more years ago than I care to admit. I don't ever need to watch it again. I get that people can take away deeper meaning from the rape scenes and violence, but there are other ways to raise questions about morality and justice than what Kubrick does here. I'd put Taxi Driver over this without even thinking about it. Taxi Driver gets to all the shocking things (like Jodie Foster's character) without actually showing rape scenes. The total gory shoot out at the end is shocking not only in its violence, but also because it is used so sparingly in the movie, and the rest of the film basically just insinuated. Look at Psycho, that murder scene to me was so much more terrifying because of its intimacy and how it leaves you with your own imagination as to the stabbings. I get that art should be open to the offensive and the shocking including sexual violence, but as a woman and survivor of sexual violence, I chose not to engage. I appreciate the discussion the movie is allowing us to have, and I appreciate the deep dives into the scenes, but I won't be rewatching.

Meryl Streep does have She-Devil, which could make very easily for a HDTGM episode.

I'm pretty sure my first introduction to Meryl was in She-Devil as a pink-themed romance author. I definitely still like her best in comedic roles. Glad everyone is on board for this!

I also ate it up at the theater! I'm going to have to see it again to see everything I clearly missed the first time. Oh, I loved Widows! Powerhouse performances. I really do wish the miniseries were available. I can't even find discs that will play on US equipment.

Sorry for the late post! Monday snuck right up on me! I was inspired by Unspooled, and have wanted to watch this one, so I give you: This is available on AmazonPrime, too.

Kirstie Alley might be a better mom than Paul and crew think!

Smart take. Also, when she pulled out the Christmas presents for the kids in the car, I didn't think so much that she had given up and thought they were going to die, but wanted to give the kids something to occupy themselves, and to distract the kids from the situation while she tried to figure out a solution. I do kind of like the idea of hitting a tree and going, "well, that's it kids! It's all over" Oh this movie was painful!

I'll put it out there that I was not a big fan of this one. Maybe it was that I wasn't in the right mood or head space for it, but it didn't move me at all. I found all of the characters rather unlikable. I found Nathan an abusive and manipulative person. I agree with Cameron H. that this wasn't a love triangle. The inclusion of Stingo into their relationship felt more poly to me. But that could be my current sensibilities. I got the sense that Nathan and Sophie really cared for each other. I think he admired her for her experience. He knew he was sheltered, and I think he hoped to kind of explore and live the world vicariously through her. 's I do think I'd have liked this better if we saw it from Sophie's point of view as opposed to (as Danny said) from Stingo's point of view. I don't think we need him as a stand-in for the audience. I think seeing it from her POV we could still have her see herself through the eyes of a naive writer (maybe even a woman) as she brings the writer into her life, and opens herself up as she realizes she can finally trust someone with her secrets. I think we'd get more of that personal discovery. I also think it would've made the scene of her giving up her daughter feel more affecting.

That is amazing! How could he not have brought that up?!

I can get behind this 100%

I wasn't able to make it all the way through the Star Wars Holiday Special on my own. I think it would be more enjoyable as a group experience.

Deck the Halls? or did you do that recently? ETA: I obviously had not yet read the other thread