Cameron H.

What's even worse is that she tells Michael that Stephanie is one of her very best friends, yet she gets shut out the Pink Ladies like she's a fucking leper. I have to think about my team. Might be team Patty Simcox, not sure yet.

Taylor Anne, I had typed this whole thing out in response to one of your posts until I realized that we were basically arguing the same point...

I think we may need to be more philosophical about this. Maybe it's not really important if her change at the end is "good" or "bad." Maybe what's important, and ultimately meaningful, is her willingness to change. That change is good. What we see at the end isn't the end result of who Sandy will ultimately become, but the first step of a life long journey of self discovery. She was stagnating as Sandra Dee, but as Sandy, she can have whatever future she is willing to to carve out for herself. It doesn't matter if that future is to be the first woman to drive to the moon or to be the devoted wife of the local gas station owner. What matters most is that she has reached a point where she is making these these decisions for herself. Also, I think we have to cut Danny some slack about the Letterman's jacket. He seems very proud of it. He even brags about it to the other T-Birds when he calls them out for still "stealing hubcaps." (Again, there's that theme of change and personal growth.) For all we know, after the credits roll, that there isn't a really awkward scene of them having to fly back to the carnival to pick it up.

I can definitely see resignation in that stanza, but I can also see it as someone who is making the courageous decision to cast aside the security blanket that she has wrapped herself in her entire life. I really feel like Sandy comes to the decision by herself. Danny loves her for who she is. And while his immaturity does make him act out in dumb ways, he never says at any time, "I like you, but I can't be with you unless you're more like this..." And it's the same with the Pink Ladies. Frenchie wants Sandy in their group as is. While Rizzo does make fun of her, there's never a discussion of, " You can't join unless you change. " Since their isn't any external pressure for her to change, I can only assume that her transformation is because it's something that she actually wants. But honestly, I think it all really depends on the production you're watching and how they decide to interpret those lines. I really believe it can go either way. On a slightly different note, after re-watching the first movie, I'm even more depressed about where Frenchie ends up. Yes, she tinted her hair pink, but she was able to give Sandy a very successful makeover. It seems like her failure at beauty school has less to do with her ability, and more that they had her working in the wrong genre--they were teaching her Classical while she excells at Rock and Roll. When Sandy transforms, we're also getting closure on Frenchie's storyline. Frenchie is going to be okay. She's going to be an excellent beautician, just as long as she continues to be herself. Having her end back up at Rydell seriously undermines that triumph.

That's funny you brought all this up because I was thinking something along the same lines. After watching Grease 2, I went back and watched the original (no contest, waaaaaaaay better) and I didn't have the same issue with Sandy's transformation as I've had in the past. In fact, I found it kind of endearing. I think what changed my mind on it was, just before the finale, she is watching Danny win at Thunder Road, and there is a quick "Look at Me, I'm Sandra Dee" reprise. What I never noticed in the lyrics before is she sings, "Look at me, there has to be, something more than what THEY see" I don't know why, but this line makes a world of difference to me in terms of interpreting the ending. She's not doing it for Danny. She's not even really doing it for the Pink Ladies or the T-Birds. She's basically taking a look at herself and saying, "When people look at me they see this 'scared' and 'unsure' person, but is that the person I truly am? Is that the person I want to be? Is there more to me that even I don't know?" So while I'd say Danny's transformation is a bit more superficial, hers is her taking back her agency. She's saying, "I won't be this wilting flower anymore! I'm asserting myself. I want things (e.g. Danny), and I'm going after them." I think what makes it confusing is her transformation conveniently makes it easier for them to be together as it breaks down the social barriers that have, heretofore, been keeping them apart. But remember, he fell in love with her at the beach long before her transformation. If all he wants is someone to have sex with, he doesn't really seem to have any trouble (Rizzo and Cha Cha for two). So while it might seem like Danny is only really interested because Sandy suddenly seems to be down to clown, what I think Danny is actually responding to is Sandy's newfound confidence. I don't know. That's how I saw it anyway...

So, I was thinking about "Cool Rider" and trying to determine what exactly Zinone's criteria for a dating a guy is beyond simply "owning, and having the ability to operate, a motorcycle." As others have already stated, just based on that, anyone of the T-Birds should have been able to meet those standards. And honestly, she doesn't give us a lot of specifics. However, she does say that she's looking for "a dream on a mean machine with Hell in his eyes" and that "he's gonna be wild as the wind." But, don't these particulars more or less disqualify Michael as her "Cool Rider?" With his goggles on, how does she know if there's "Hell" in them or not? And a guy who quickly rides away every time the T-Birds give him the stank eye doesn't exactly sound like a person who is as "wild as the wind." The only other things she sings about specifically is that she wants "a man growing out of the seat" and that when he's around "the ground will be shakin'." So, based on the few details we're provided, I have to say that I think the person who comes closest to Zinone's ideal "Cool Rider" might actually be 1980's X-Men villain Bonebreaker.

I still think it's bullshit that their act seemed to have a higher production value when compared to the other acts. I think the T-Birds got a lamppost, and all the other acts got nothing. Just seems like it's cheating. Oh, and having a teenage girl come out in lingerie because she represents "summer," that's also bullshit and wildly inappropriate.

Was anyone else disappointed that the whole "nose job" thing didn't really go anywhere? Was she still going to go through with it or did she discover sometime during the course of the movie that true beauty lies within? Goddamn you, screenwriters! How dare you introduce us to these rich, three dimensional characters and not give us any closure!

You know what's fucking embarrassing? Not only do these "rebels" feel that their rep is tied to good grades and solid attendance, but in order to get the Roy Orbinson "albumens," they are willing to humiliate themselves in front of the entire school. Do you think Ponyboy or Two-Bit would do that rank crap ? Hell no! That just reeks of effort. Real Greasers would steal that shit before their rumble with the Socs. Because that's fucking tuff. Also, while I'm on the topic of the Talent Show. When the twins ask Michael to play piano, I thought they meant IN the Talent Show, not FOR the Talent Show. Considering he's a teenager and apparently provided accompaniment for ALL the acts, I kind of think he should have won. Then again, he wasn't there for the big show and no one seemed to notice, so maybe not...

How's this for a parallel? Due to external obstacles and social pressure, two star-crossed teenagers fall in love. So, of course, the Shakespeare play they are studying is--um...Hamlet?

Right. So at the end of the movie after Stephanie and Bobby have been crowned King and Queen of the, uh...Talent Show, they are taken to where a celebratory luau is being held in honor of their successful production. They are carried upon a litter into a small above-ground pool to float and preside over their plebeian peers in watery, adolescent majesty. Then, suddenly, two things happen at once: first, Bobby manages to light their raft on fire, and two, the rival biker gangs crashes the party. The whole scene erupts into chaos while these two fucking geniuses try to row to the edge of the pool on their burning raft. Jesus Christ, guys! The pool isn't more than 3 feet deep and (maybe) 15 feet in diameter. Hey dumb-dumbs, why don't you get off the fucking thing and just wade your happy asses over to the side? Clearly, being "cool" isn't everything... Also, since I'm talking about the end of the movie, I found the number they chose to close out the movie to be an odd choice. In the first Grease, the movie ends at a carnival with all the principal players joining hands to take their final bow. And as their voices are lifted into the sky in joyous harmony, they sing the rambunctious, "We Go Together." But, for some reason, in Grease 2, they decided to end the movie with the dirge-like, "We'll Be Together." It's like the movie knew that these characters had already peaked and the rest of their lives were destined to be a joyless slog of interminable mediocrity. Fun times.

Sure it is. I'm pretty sure Malcolm Gladwell said, "10,000 hours or a couple afternoons a week dicking around in the park."

Well, I finally finished the episode and i thought it was a lot of fun! Did anyone else think it was weird that as Michael makes his way to the bowling alley he seems to be frantically consulting an Emily Post-esque manners guidebook on how exactly to ask the T-Birds if he can join them in a game? I mean, as long as you're going to include this scene, i think it's a real missed opportunity that the book isn't at least a "Nerd to Cool" dictionary or "American Slang for Native British Speakers." Instead, the advice it gives him is, "Always be courteous when asking for a game." Dude, if you need a goddamn manual to tell you that, then there's a very good chance that you're a fucking sociopath and probably do belong at the bottom of Dead Man's Curve in a mangled heap. Also, I felt it was odd that auditions for the "JUNE Moon Talent Show" were announced on the very first day of school. June is an awfully long way away from September. Is there really nothing else going on at Rydell? No plays or anything? Shit, Homecoming has to be coming up pretty soon, maybe they should be more concerned about that? I just really have a sinking suspicion that Rydell's obsession with this "talent show" may be taking a toll on the quality of education their students are receiving. How else can you explain a Health teacher teaching a room full of very horny (and very confused) teenagers that "to conceive" (verb) is the same thing as "fertile" (adjective)? Then, during the Reproduction song, when a sexually desperate teenager calls out for some one to let him know where they are, two helpful students reply, "Chapter 2. Page 5." Are you telling me that the first chapter of their Human Sexuality and Reproduction textbook is no more than 5 pages long?!? What the fuck, Rydell? These kids are seriously not ready for the real world!

May 26th?

Yes. I know.

I just hope the papers were on as broad and generic a subject matter as possible, like "William Shakespeare" or "Restoration Theatre." You know, things that can be easily summed up in just a couple of wide ruled notebook pages.

I liked the last few pages of that thread, though. It reinforced for me why this is (ultimately) a great, supportive, and fun community. As for your other post, I'm in the same boat. I'm dying to listen, but currently deep in the weeds. And with two sick kids at home, who knows when I'll get a chance to listen.

Man! If everyone on the boards manages to get to the Austin show, and I can't get my shit together to make it happen, I'm gonna be one sad motherfucking panda.

I totally agree! I had never seen it before, but I'm actually going to try to get another viewing in tomorrow morning. It's dumb, but it's fun dumb.

Oh, fuck no! I was legit going to try and maybe fly out there for that one too. To think you live out that way and still couldn't get in...

You're lucky. I thought Joe Piscopo at first, and then was like, "No, that's...um, that's Michael McDonald. No wait! Christopher McDonald! Christopher McDonald!" But it was too late. The damage was done. Now I can't get "What a Fool Believes" out of my fucking brain. Will I ever know a life that isn't scored by the Doobie Bros? God, I hope so...but, for now, that's my reality...

I think that's because Travolta (and much of the original cast) could actually dance. In the first one, I think it paid for them to give everyone space to do their thing, whereas in the second movie, since they couldn't do better, they just went with bigger and just hoped Michelle Pfeiffer's embarrassingly spastastic "dancing" would get lost in the crowd.

To be honest, yes, as hard as it might be to believe today, Roy Orbison was really big in 1961. You have to realize, at this point, rockers like Buddy Holly and Eddie Cochran were already dead, and Elvis had just gotten out of the Army the year before. Orbison, this kind of weird guy who was always wearing sunglasses, was kind of what you had in terms of non-teeny bop Frankie Avalon-type garbage. I mean, it's weird to imagine a Greaser into something like "Only the Lonely," but they were, and that's also ignoring a ton of his material. It would be like taking "Can't Help Falling in Love" and "Are You Lonesome Tonight?" and saying all Elvis did was sappy love songs. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U6G-GdhLP4o I mean, it might have been better had they chosen someone like Chuck Berry, Little Richard, or Gary U.S. Bonds, but not everyone was ready at that time to fully embrace "Black" music, so it's not exactly crazy that this guy would be more into Orbison.

Oh! Didn't you hear? Expressing extreme outrage is the new normal. Get with it. For example, this is how I react when people choose the entryway of a store to stop and have a conversation: