Musical Mondays Week 15 The Fantasticks (1995)

[EvRobert 1684]

Correct! I should have clarified in that in the stage version Mortimer is much chattier. I think Ritchie thought he could kill two birds with one stone by casting Teller as Mortimer and giving him JUST the one speech.

[Cam Bert 8145]

Interesting note: while I agree with EvR's suggestion that it looks like Mortimer and the Mute were merged, that's not the case. In reality, El Gallo takes on most of the Mute's jobs (snowing etc). Casting Teller makes it seem like Mortimer's mute, because Teller's usual schtick is to not speak, but (as you well know EvR) Mortimer has a major, important speech right after El Gallo is 'defeated'.

 

And here it is. I present the non-mute Mortimer.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ts1UME4_2WM

This clip reminded me of one of the questions I had while watching this, why is El Gallo so dead set against the fathers picking Henry? Also why is Henry kept in a box?

[Cakebug Tranch 6873]

Henry's in the box in the play - as EG says in his opening speech, "everything else, we can get from this box". So, Henry's a prop, who lives in the box. I remember when I saw it at the Sullivan Street Theater there was a little curtain that the Mute quietly pulled across between the seat and the box which allowed Henry to crawl unseen behind and through a hole in the back of the box, to magically appear from what was previously empty. His final speech (seen in the deleted scene) is very important because it returns Henry to the box.

 

Not sure why El Gallo is suggesting other options - maybe they're less histrionic than H+M?

[Cakebug Tranch 6873]

I found this article really useful. Looks like I'll be buying the Blu-Ray now!

 

the last movie musical

 

Good news. The recent Twilight Time Blu-ray release of Michael Ritchie's "The Fantasticks" includes not only the truncated 86-minute release version of the movie musical but also Ritchie's original 109-minutes cut, as edited by William Scharf, in standard definition. And it's terrific.

 

Twenty years later, we can see now see Ritchie's vision - an immaculate film most likely doomed because of its loving fidelity to the original Tom Jones-Harvey Schmidt 1960 stage production. The landmark musical started life as a small off-Broadway effort that subsequently ran for a whopping 17,162 performances - that's 42 record-breaking years.

 

Ritchie kept matters intimate, despite his film's open-air settings, and even though movie musicals had virtually no audience interest in 1995, the filmmaker probably thought - and rightfully so - that those 42 years in New York meant that the show had an obsessively loyal following.

 

But those people (plus those who had performed the show in school and in community productions) never got a chance to see the film. United Artists test-screened "The Fantasticks" for audiences no longer familiar with film musicals. The scores were predictably low, the film was shelved.

 

For five years.

 

MGM Home Entertainment was preparing a direct-to-video release of Ritchie's cut in 2000 when Francis Ford Coppola reportedly stepped forward and offered to re-edit the film for a theatrical release.

 

Twenty-three minutes were taken out of "The Fantasticks" and it was given a "limited release" in only four markets - New York, Los Angeles, San Francisco and Sacramento. The film played a week and then went away until it materialized on home entertainment in Coppola's cut, not Ritchie's.

 

Ritchie supported Coppola's cut. He died in 2001. "The Fantasticks" was not his last movie, as widely reported. (That would be "A Simple Wish" in 1997.) Now it's 2015. Twenty long years have passed and Ritchie is gone but "The Fantasticks" has somehow, miraculously, survived. The fastidious attention that Michael Ritchie devoted his movie is, well, humbling.

 

His film is not an adaptation of "The Fantasticks." It is "The Fantasticks." Ritchie retained the show's original graphic (as seen in the frame from the opening credits above), as well as the show's overture - arguably the second most famous musical overture after Jules Styne's "Gypsy."

 

Now, about the Coppola cut... It is just another example of what studios traditionally have done when confronted with tightening movie musicals. For some bizarre reason, the customary mentality has always been to trim the very elements that define a musical - the songs. In the case of "The Fantasticks," some songs were routinely trimmed, while two were cut altogether - "Plant a Radish" and, unbelievably, the opening rendition of the show's most emblematic song, the achingly beautiful "Try to Remember." (That's Jonathon Morris pictured above singing the song).

 

It's ironic that when it comes to his own films, Coppola adds footage (see "Apocalypse Now Redux"), but then it's unclear if Coppola personally re-edited "The Fantasticks" himself (see Note in Passing below).

 

That said, many thanks to Craig Spaulding, Ed Dennis and their gang at Twilight Time for believing in Ritchie's film and presenting its Blu-ray incarnation as something of an event - a circumstance that I could have never imagined. And thanks to Julie Kirgo for astute liner notes that express thoughts about the film that the critics missed. And the topping, of course, is the privileged experience of seeing Ritchie's original cut - a straightforward, no-frills, no-nonsense, old-fashioned movie musical.

 

This is not a modern aberration, along the lines of Baz Luhrmann's "Moulin Rouge." No, it's a real musical. The last real movie musical.

 

An element that's available on the MGM Home Entertainment DVD of the film, but not included on the new Blu-ray, is a rough filming of "It Depends on What You Pay (The Rape Song)" as written for the original '60 stage production of "The Fantasticks." The roughness is evident in the frame pictured above. Ritchie must have filmed it as a test or perhaps a favor to the composers. The song was eventually re-filmed and used in the movie but as "The Seduction Song," reworked by Jones and Schmidt.

 

Note in Passing: Much was made about Francis Ford Coppola being brought in and using his American Zoetrope facilities to re-edit the film, reducing it from 109 minutes to 86 minutes. But an end title on the release version of "The Fantasticks" credits Melissa Kent with the "additional editing." Hmmm. That title card, incidentally, replaced one in the end credits of the Ritchie version that announced that the film's soundtrack album would be available on Telrac Records.

 

Of course, a soundtrack album never materialized.

 

Finally, The Hallmark Hall of Fame aired a one-hour adaptation of "The Fantasticks" in 1964, starring Ricardo Montalban as El Greco, Stanely Holloway and Bert Lahr as the fathers, John Davidson as Matt and Susan Watson as Luisa. Watson, who created the role of Kim MacAfee in the original 1960 Broadway production of "Bye Bye Birdie," created the role in the inaugural Barnard College production of "The Fantasticks."

 

Source: http://thepassionate...ie-musical.html

[Cakebug Tranch 6873]

I just watched the Hallmark Hall of Fame version of the play on YouTube. It's shorter (an hour) so is missing a lot, but it's much closer to the original structure. I enjoyed it.

 

[FisterRoboto 7499]

Seriously, if M took the perfect plums I was saving for my breakfast, no note would be enough.

 

And that's how a jaded mandarin will fuck you up over missing plums.

[Cameron H. 23786]

Have you guys seen Jaded Mandarins, Missing Plums?

[Cameron H. 23786]

I know most of you were fans of the movie, but did anyone else get weepy during "Try to Remember?"

 

Just me?

 

Cool, cool.

[Cakebug Tranch 6873]

I know most of you were fans of the movie, but did anyone else get weepy during "Try to Remember?"

 

Just me?

 

Cool, cool.

Absolutely NOT just you! It's a lovely song. My wife and I both got a little sappy over 'They Were You'. We first sang that song together as 21 year olds and now we're getting ready to turn 40.

[Cam Bert 8145]

I know most of you were fans of the movie, but did anyone else get weepy during "Try to Remember?"

 

Just me?

 

Cool, cool.

It's a good song and been in my head, but I think it would have been more affecting if it did bookend it all.

[Cameron H. 23786]

Absolutely NOT just you! It's a lovely song. My wife and I both got a little sappy over 'They Were You'. We first sang that song together as 21 year olds and now we're getting ready to turn 40.

 

Yeah. I mean, I didn't either. That's dumb. I just wanted to know if any of you had so I could make fun of you.

[Cameron H. 23786]

It's a good song and been in my head, but I think it would have been more affecting if it did bookend it all.

 

Like I said, I didn't cry. I don't want anyone to think of me watching this on my phone in the dark last night crying silently to myself like some kind of loser.

 

Now that that's out of the way, did it kind remind anyone else of "There's Always Tomorrow" from Rudolph?

 

[tomspanks 9039]

Now that that's out of the way, did it kind remind anyone else of "There's Always Tomorrow" from Rudolph?

 

No, but it did remind me of the beginning of the audition song (The Fools Who Dream) from La La Land.

[IMAHUGEHDTGMFAN 1837]

Trying to make time to watch this... Will report back when I do...

 

P.S.: BRAVO! for this thread

 

[Cameron H. 23786]

I just finished the 1964 Hallmark movie version, and I have to say, the 1995 version certainly sells us a bill of goods. However, I wasn't that impressed with it, either. It was definitely different, but I didn't find it any better really. In fact, I think I had a better experience with the newer one. :wacko:/>

[Cakebug Tranch 6873]

I just finished the 1964 Hallmark movie version, and I have to say, the 1995 version certainly sells us a bill of goods. However, I wasn't that impressed with it. It was definitely different, but I didn't find it any better really. In fact, I think I had a better experience with the newer one.

[Cameron H. 23786]

I've got something controversial to say...

 

I think if Tim Burton "Big Fish-ed" The Fantasticks, and excluded Johnny Depp (even though you just KNOW he'd want to cast him as El Gallo), it could be pretty interesting.

[Cakebug Tranch 6873]

I've got something controversial to say...

 

I think if Tim Burton "Big Fish-ed" The Fantasticks, and excluded Johnny Depp (even though you just KNOW he'd want to cast him as El Gallo), it could be pretty interesting.

I don't think that's controversial - I'd be on board. I'd be less worried about Johnny as El Gallo than I would be about Helena Bonham-Carter as Luisa...

[tomspanks 9039]

I've got something controversial to say...

 

I think if Tim Burton "Big Fish-ed" The Fantasticks, and excluded Johnny Depp (even though you just KNOW he'd want to cast him as El Gallo), it could be pretty interesting.

 

That's funny because the 95 movie didn't work for me because it tried to be too quirky/twee and El Gallo reminded me of a bobo Capt Sparrow.

[Cam Bert 8145]

What did everyone think of the guy that played El Gallo? He looked like the love child of Peter O'Toole and Jesse Eisenberg to me. I thought he also seemed a bit... too normal perhaps.

[Cakebug Tranch 6873]

I always thought he was too much of a wimp. El Gallo in my mind is supposed to be Spanish, but I guess the idea of him being English and playing this rogue makes some sense. Jonathon Morris, who plays him in the movie, played El Gallo in the England run of the show, which I guess is why he was cast. But I think they could have done better. Antonio Banderas!

[EvRobert 1684]

I don't think that's controversial - I'd be on board. I'd be less worried about Johnny as El Gallo than I would be about Helena Bonham-Carter as Luisa...

 

You know he'd cast HBC as one of the Fathers just to be daring and different.

[EvRobert 1684]

Jonathon Morris as El Gallo was too...safe. I don't know who in 1995 I would have cast, but it wouldn't have been him.

[Cam Bert 8145]

I always thought he was too much of a wimp. El Gallo in my mind is supposed to be Spanish, but I guess the idea of him being English and playing this rogue makes some sense. Jonathon Morris, who plays him in the movie, played El Gallo in the England run of the show, which I guess is why he was cast. But I think they could have done better. Antonio Banderas!

I kinda liked the fact that he was British. Much like the original casting of Jerry Orbach I like the idea of this character just using the name for show and being very much not Spanish. Just another layer to paint him as a bit more of a huckster type at the start. As for who I would have liked to have seen in the role, 1995? Hmmm... give me a moment to think. Pierce Brosnan? Though based on Mama Mia I don't know...

[EvRobert 1684]

I'm looking at the list of the movies of 1995. Here's some suggestions just looking at the box office and awards though...

 

my first thought is Val Kilmer. He was coming off of TOMBSTONE and did Batman Forever that year.

 

Nic Cage? Would this have been better with Nic CAge? Possibly. He won the Academy Award that year for Leaving Las Vegas.

 

Patrick Swayze was kind of on his downslide but it would have been interesting to see what he would have done.

 

Denzel? Imagine a 1995 Denzel coming off of MUCH ADO ABOUT NOTHING and CRIMSON TIDE.