A message from Earwolf's CEO about yesterday's episode de-publishing

[MeowingForVengeance 16]

 

Well how about the things that were behind paywalls that they brought out for free, like getting Jimmy Pardo and Never Not Funny to bring their stuff out from behind the paywall for us? It's not a one way street here. CAPS

 

Nothing against Never Not Funny, but I very rarely listen to it. I don't listen to a lot of shows on Earwolf--which is another problem with Howl: I end up paying for a bunch of stuff I'm not even going to listen to. I like MaxFun's approach much more for this reason. I like The Flop House, I donate directly to The Flop House, I get exclusive Flop House episodes. Easy peasy.

[DanEngler 5249]

Real talk though, why did OP post in black text?

When you copy text from Google Docs or other web pages and paste it into the forum's text editor, the text style (including color) gets carried over. I hate it but there's no workaround except turning off text formatting altogether.

[mduncan55 12]

 

I was talking about the original poster, not you. But again man, why so fucking aggressive for no reason? Yeah, they solicited donations to keep shows free...they didn't get enough donations to keep shows free. That was the entire implication of all that. 'Help us keep the shows free by donating...' if we they didn't get enough donations, then the shows wouldn't be free anymore. They didn't get enough but the new shows, and 6 months of shows ARE STILL FREE. And the original shows were free for YEARS.

 

Seriously, take the 2 minutes to listen to the beginning of the new HDTGM episode, and you will hear Paul say exactly what I have been. This is not what they want. They fought against it, and are continuing to fight to find a better solution because this is not what they signed on for. So while I'm being accused of being entitled for "acting like I know what the content creators want", there you go, they just told you themselves. But hey, at least the poor corporation has you there to protect their feelings.

 

As for buying a smart phone and accessories for it, no, I'm not going to spend money so that I can spend more money to listen to something I can listen to for free, and also, iPods and Androids are notorious for not liking to go swimming.

[LMS 0]

I noticed the Howl app has a 2-ish rating right now--have they improved on it at all, or is it still really that mediocre? I haven't had any real problems with it, but I'm mostly concerned with the content.

[joel_rosenbaum 1269]

 

Nothing against Never Not Funny, but I very rarely listen to it. I don't listen to a lot of shows on Earwolf--which is another problem with Howl: I end up paying for a bunch of stuff I'm not even going to listen to. I like MaxFun's approach much more for this reason. I like The Flop House, I donate directly to The Flop House, I get exclusive Flop House episodes. Easy peasy.

Do you do that with Netflix content, as well?

 

You might have noticed that the broadcast model is popular, even with non-traditional broadcasting services. That's because there's a risk involved in making content and providers typically can't afford to produce their own work. Broadcasters accept that risk in exchange for prospective profits. I mean, this is basic economics.

[MeowingForVengeance 16]

Do you do that with Netflix content, as well?

 

You might have noticed that the broadcast model is popular, even with non-traditional broadcasting services. That's because there's a risk involved in making content and providers typically can't afford to produce their own work. Broadcasters accept that risk in exchange for prospective profits. I mean, this is basic economics.

 

Why would I care about economics, basic or otherwise? I just listen to podcasts.

 

Howl ain't Netflix, no matter how much it wants to be. I can justify only watching a small percentage of what's on there because it's convenient and reliable. Howl is neither, at least not for me. I mean it's been out for well over a year and they still don't even have official RSS feeds. Comparing Howl to Netflix only makes Howl look worse.

[Kickpuncher 5012]

 

Why would I care about economics, basic or otherwise? I just listen to podcasts.

 

 

Because it often provides an easy explanation for why things aren't always exactly how you want them to be.

[Darbler Cheesegarbler 1110]

Amazing content, unusable app.

[mduncan55 12]

 

Because it often provides an easy explanation for why things aren't always exactly how you want them to be.

 

Even easier economics lesson, taking advantage of the example provided. This is half the price of Netflix. The shows on Netflix cost hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of dollars to make per episode. A podcast costs maybe a hundred bucks, covered by donations and ads. We are obviously getting crap value for our money. (Again, my issue here isn't the cost, it's the greed and going against the content creators' wishes, but don't try to make this sound like some great value.)

[FisterRoboto 7499]

 

Even easier economics lesson, taking advantage of the example provided. This is half the price of Netflix. The shows on Netflix cost hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of dollars to make per episode. A podcast costs maybe a hundred bucks, covered by donations and ads. We are obviously getting crap value for our money.

Because you have access to their budget, I'm sure, and you know how much the hosts make, how much the engineers make, and how much all the other Earwolf employees that perform various behind-the-scenes tasks make. Additionally, I promise you that Netflix has an exponentially higher base of subscribers, which gives them the capital to make their original series. Additionally, it took them 14 years to make one of these series (well after they were dominating the market financially and had plenty of revenue to expend on such a venture).

 

There are plenty of other differentiators on why the Netflix model is different, but you seem to be content to do whatever mental gymnastics possible to justify your position that it's okay to steal content if you don't like paying for it, so I'll spare you the lesson, which will almost certainly fall on deaf ears.

[mduncan55 12]

Because you have access to their budget, I'm sure, and you know how much the hosts make, how much the engineers make, and how much all the other Earwolf employees that perform various behind-the-scenes tasks make. Additionally, I promise you that Netflix has an exponentially higher base of subscribers, which gives them the capital to make their original series. Additionally, it took them 14 years to make one of these series (well after they were dominating the market financially and had plenty of revenue to expend on such a venture).

 

There are plenty of other differentiators on why the Netflix model is different, but you seem to be content to do whatever mental gymnastics possible to justify your position that it's okay to steal content if you don't like paying for it, so I'll spare you the lesson, which will almost certainly fall on deaf ears.

 

You can say whatever you want. The hosts made nothing. They made these free, with the expectation that the podcasts are free, and are unhappy that people are now being charged for it, and are "looking into alternatives" which quite frankly I hope means taking their intellectual property and finding a less greedy place to release it from. Hey, I wasn't the one that brought up the Netflix model as a comparison to begin with, so don't try lecturing me that it's not the same.

[MeowingForVengeance 16]

Just a friendly reminder that the very folks behind Howl called it Netflix for podcasts. They invited the comparison, they can live with it.

 

Toodles!

[Lukas Holmes 2287]

 

Even easier economics lesson, taking advantage of the example provided. This is half the price of Netflix. The shows on Netflix cost hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of dollars to make per episode. A podcast costs maybe a hundred bucks, covered by donations and ads. We are obviously getting crap value for our money. (Again, my issue here isn't the cost, it's the greed and going against the content creators' wishes, but don't try to make this sound like some great value.)

 

'Greed.' You call giving us free content for, what? 7 years? Then announcing 2 years ago that things are going behind a paywall, finally doing it (I think more than a year later than they said they were doing to do it) but still keeping all current things free and 6 months back free....is greedy? And, as they already pointed out, they take down episodes when asked to. So, maybe at some point some of the creators will say (like Jeff Garlin did) remove my stuff. But to call this 'greed', is just baffling.

[mduncan55 12]

 

'Greed.' You call giving us free content for, what? 7 years? Then announcing 2 years ago that things are going behind a paywall, finally doing it (I think more than a year later than they said they were doing to do it) but still keeping all current things free and 6 months back free....is greedy? And, as they already pointed out, they take down episodes when asked to. So, maybe at some point some of the creators will say (like Jeff Garlin did) remove my stuff. But to call this 'greed', is just baffling.

 

It's simple, the hosts did not do this for money, do not want money for it, and are upset that their fans are being charged for it. However the higher ups don't care about what the content creators want, and are doing this anyways, because they want more money. Hence: greed. Less baffling yet?

[FisterRoboto 7499]

 

Hey, I wasn't the one that brought up the Netflix model as a comparison to begin with, so don't try lecturing me that it's not the same.

Just a friendly reminder that the very folks behind Howl called it Netflix for podcasts. They invited the comparison, they can live with it.

 

Toodles!

Just a friendly reminder that comparing the content delivery systems does not make the economic models the same. This might be really hard for you to believe, but it's possible for things to be similar without being identical. This is shocking news, I am sure.

 

 

It's simple, the hosts did not do this for money, do not want money for it, and are upset that their fans are being charged for it. However the higher ups don't care about what the content creators want, and are doing this anyways, because they want more money. Hence: greed. Less baffling yet?

It's almost like this is a for-profit corporation. If you don't like it, don't pay for it. But you are still not justified in stealing the content if you don't like paying for it.

 

You can say whatever you want. The hosts made nothing. They made these free, with the expectation that the podcasts are free, and are unhappy that people are now being charged for it, and are "looking into alternatives" which quite frankly I hope means taking their intellectual property and finding a less greedy place to release it from.

I don't know much about Professor Blastoff, but Paul's message was more along the lines of, "We're trying to work for a solution that is mutually beneficial" and not the way that you are portraying it at all.

[mduncan55 12]

I don't know much about Professor Blastoff, but Paul's message was more along the lines of, "We're trying to work for a solution that is mutually beneficial" and not the way that you are portraying it at all.

 

"Jason, June and I have always had issues with this paywall, and unfortunately it was sprung on us as well as you without any warning aside from a passing mention in a Howl ad about a year ago. Now we've heard your concerns and we share them, and since this has happened we've been working with Howl and Earwolf to find a better solution, and we have a lot of good ideas which we will share with you very soon. But rest assured the team involved with this switch profusely apologize for the way it was handled. And we want to also apologize to you too because this is not our intention and we want to make the show available in a way that it has always been available, so we're working on a way to make both interests meet and I think we'll have some exciting information for you very shortly about this, so stand by and thank you for your patience." Direct quote from the beginning of this week's HDTGM. Please note: They've always had issues with the idea of a paywall on their content, this is not what they want, they want to make the show available as it has always been. So don't try to cherry pick one section of a sentance and try to twist that into their entire message.

I also reached out to the Professor Blastoff crew on Twitter to hear their thoughts, and Kyle Dunnigan said that they have already asked Earwolf to remove their content from the paywall, and to stay tuned.

[FisterRoboto 7499]

So don't try to cherry pick one section of a sentance and try to twist that into their entire message.

And you don't get to ignore the other parts they say just because it doesn't fit your viewpoint. They don't like the paywall, but he specifically says they are working for a way to make this work for BOTH parties. You've chosen to ignore the parts that don't fit your argument. They don't love the paywall idea, fine. But that is not their sole message. Yet it seems to be only part you are interested in. They are working with Earwolf/Midroll to find a mutually beneficial solution. If that solution ends up being HDTGM coming out from behind the paywall, then that's cool. If it ends up being a different solution, then we'll see what the solution is, but I will still be okay with paying to support something that gives me hours of entertainment. Same goes for Professor Blastoff.

 

You are still not entitled to steal content because you don't want to pay, regardless of what the content creators' intentions were. The content creators are not the only side of the equation, and stealing content in their name is a total red herring argument which has been what this whole conversation is about (and the argument you keep coming back to repeatedly when I point out the problems in your other arguments like the Netflix business model or ad revenue in old episodes).

[mduncan55 12]

You've done exactly that. They don't like the paywall, but he specifically says they are working for a way to make this work for BOTH parties. You've chosen to ignore the parts that don't fit your argument. They don't love the paywall idea, fine. But that is not their sole message. Yet it seems to be only part you are interested in. They are working with Earwolf/Midroll to find a mutually beneficial solution. If that solution ends up being HDTGM coming out from behind the paywall, then that's cool. If it ends up being a different solution, then we'll see what the solution is, but I will still be okay with paying to support something that gives me hours of entertainment. Same goes for Professor Blastoff.

 

You are still not entitled to steal content because you don't want to pay, regardless of what the content creators' intentions were. The content creators are not the only side of the equation, and stealing content in their name is a total red herring argument which has been what this whole conversation is about (and the argument you keep coming back to repeatedly when I point out the problems in your other arguments like the Netflix business model or ad revenue in old episodes).

 

No, I don't feel entitled to steal content because I don't want to pay. I feel entitled to listen to the content the way that the content creators always intended and continue to want their listeners to experience it.

 

And I didn't ignore any part of it. I posted the entire thing for everyone to see rather than the one heavily reworded part of a sentence that you chose to use to support your stance. You can do whatever you want. You want to stick up for the suits that have nothing to do with the creation of the content, you're more than welcome to. I'll stick with the creators.

[FisterRoboto 7499]

 

No, I don't feel entitled to steal content because I don't want to pay. I feel entitled to listen to the content the way that the content creators always intended and continue to want their listeners to experience it.

You are still stealing content that you don't think you should pay for, regardless of the way you look at it. That's really all it comes down to.

 

And I didn't ignore any part of it. I posted the entire thing for everyone to seem rather than the one heavily reworded part of a sentence that you chose to use to support your stance. You can do whatever you want. You want to stick up for the suits that have nothing to do with the creation of the content, you're more than welcome to. I'll stick with the creators.

You chose to overlook the part where he specifically says they are looking for a mutually beneficial solution. Are they unhappy with the paywall? Yes, but that's not the entire message. But whatever makes you feel like a hero for stickin' it to the suits (which has repeatedly shown your ignorance regarding how businesses actually run).

[FisterRoboto 7499]

God, I hate those awful suits that don't contribute any content or provide anything of value.

 

 

 

 

 

[Darbler Cheesegarbler 1110]

Will the episodes older than six months disappear from the Earwolf website/soundcloud too? If not, who really cares?

 

EDIT: Oops, nevermind. I see now that they are already gone... I guess I'll have to go elsewhere to listen to my favourite episodes, since the widow Howl app is absolute garbage on Android.

[RichardHumphreys 3]

I subscribe to three Earwolf podcasts. Two of them were longer-running ones that I started listening to from the beginning. I came here today to find out why those two wouldn't download the next episodes.

 

I'm dropping these podcasts. I'm not going to download extra apps or jump through any other hurdles for specific podcasts. I also am unlikely to discover any other Earwolf podcasts, because I'm not the type to listen to a podcast from the middle. It looks like that eliminates any podcast older than six months now.

 

I'm not here to say anyone owes me anything. I'm not going to change how I listen, so I just want to encourage you to reconsider so that I can return to listening to Earwolf podcasts one day.

 

Best wishes.

[SeveralCircles 426]

You are still stealing content that you don't think you should pay for, regardless of the way you look at it. That's really all it comes down to.

 

 

You chose to overlook the part where he specifically says they are looking for a mutually beneficial solution. Are they unhappy with the paywall? Yes, but that's not the entire message. But whatever makes you feel like a hero for stickin' it to the suits (which has repeatedly shown your ignorance regarding how businesses actually run).

 

 

This dude's not worth it, F-Rob

[CaptPukeFish 284]

But who will sympathize with and pity me?!! A willing patron that can afford the price of two coffees a month and already happily gives it to these deserving artists, but then also enjoys the ads because they are delivered in an entertaining and comedic fashion that I also get a level of enjoyment from? Where will I find consolation? When will the unbearable pain and injustice of this world regress for me and my ilk? Please present your answer in the form of a dance number, or I walk.

[Trurl 38]

Making all these shows costs money...I don't get why people have a sense of entitlement that they should have free access. You have bigger issues that you should deal with if you can't afford to pay $5 a month.

/thread

 

The only other thing I'd say is I hope there will be RSS support for Howl, because listening in MusicBee > the browser.

And you probably should have at least left a sample of small gems like Rafflecast and Womp It Up, as opposed to pulling it all down, for newcomers' sakes.