Episode 161 - The Fate of the Furious

[FisterRoboto 7499]

In the early 70s, George Lucas wrote a script for a movie that was a throwback to the action serials he loved as a kid. The idea was that the movie would have "only the good parts" from the movies without the sequences he felt were either padding or that slowed the action down too much.

 

Almost ten years later, he and Spielberg released that movie as Raiders of the Lost Ark. This "only the good parts" mentality is why Indiana Jones movies are usually action set piece after action set piece. Exposition is brief and only used to set up the next set piece. Lucas and Spielberg developed the films largely by coming up with the set pieces and then building a story around them.

 

They're largely devoid of the kind of intricate, "worldbuilding" lore we see in today's blockbuster series. The stories largely serve as standalone tales that can be enjoyed with little to now knowledge of the other films in the series. By design, you can jump in at, say, The Last Crusade and get pretty much everything out of it without having seen either of the previous two films.

 

So, to that effect, the F&F films are really the cultural heir to the Indiana Jones series. They aren't the same kind of action/adventure movie, but starting with the fourth movie, these each become largely standalone movies based around action set piece after action set piece. Sure, there are things you understand more fully if you've seen all of the movies, but no one I know has been lost going into 7 or 8 without having seen the previous movies.

[NundercoverBrother 174]

 

Fast and Fur10us.

 

Theyd be dumb if they dont do that.

[IMAHUGEHDTGMFAN 1837]

*LOOONG POST WARNING*

 

Omission:

 

*The gang did not discuss the Charlize/Vin kiss in front of Michelle Rodriguez...

 

I MUST KNOW... did June liked it??? lol

 

*After the Cuban car race, when Dom and Letty are in bed it seemed to me that the script/movie was planting the seed ( so to speak ) so that when at the end Letty is introduced to Dom's + Helena's baby she (and to an extent the audience) can/have to be cool with it, because he asked her in bed if she was going to say she was pregnant but she answers that although she was not preggers she definitely wants a baby with him/give him a baby (something along those lines) down the road, so Dom can have a father/son relationship similar to the Cuban father and son they where talking in spanish about using boat parts to repair their car engine (also making it sound like she just does not want to carry a baby in her belly for approx. 9 months right now. I wonder if the makers of F&F just didn't want to turn Letty into Mia number 2 by getting her pregnant and killing her character with motherhood, as June would say... Maybe?... I dunno)

 

 

Now Reply-o-Rama Time!

 

The knowledge that 1 man is writing the scripts for all these movies gives me new insight into the narrative direction of the series, especially the 8th, 9th and 10th films touted as the final trilogy.

 

"Furious 7" -- Deckard Shaw introduced, Han dies, Kurt Russel introduced, Djimon Hounsou's character introduced, Brian and Mia retire, Ramsay introduced, The Rock joins the family

 

As you can see, narrative threads sprinkled in even-number entries are picked up in future even-number entries as well as the same happening for consecutive odd-numbered entries. So therefore all signs point to some approximation of the following:

 

All in all, I'm seeing a lot of potential for Jason Mantzoukas to appear in either of these films. Ramsay's brother perhaps

 

Also in F7 Mia gets pregnant again

 

Yeah, and Jason has the same curly hair as Ramsey!!!

 

For the record, it would not ruin my experience AT ALL if June, Paul, and Jason were the only other people in the theater and they laughed through the movie.

 

When I went to see it the theater was packed and n the Charlize/Vin kiss there was a collective audible gasp ( Again... why was it not talked about in the episode? ) also there was a huge cheer and applause when Dom revealed his sons name at the end.

 

I want to finish the episode before I get into my C&Os (mainly just This Week in Feminism) but I need to say this -

 

Jason Statham being in the middle of a gun fight while holding a baby carrier is the single greatest thing this series has done!

 

It also reminded me of the "Transporter 1" fighting style wich I love.

 

I heard a completely unverified Twitter rumor that Han was coming back in 9. So maybe they know he's alive? But then what was the POINT of the last movie...

 

You're right, it doesn't make sense.

 

Get the God's Eye Maybe?

 

I want to ask everyone that complains about Han: did you not pay attention to the movie?

 

It's revealed that Cipher was manipulating them the exact same way she was manipulating Dom. Shaw did what he did for his family - the same way that Dom does. And in the end, he rescues part of Dom's literal family. The team is definitely not totally cool with him for most of the movie. It's only during the final scene after he's rescued Dom's son that he is invited to be a real member of the gang.

 

I don't want this to sound nitpicky (but I know I will) I just didn't quite get that from what the 8th movie showed us. Also Jason Statham's epic monologue/speech to his comatose brother from the hospital scene opening of F7 is pointless if he was really seeking revenge on Cypher (Granted they had not written part 8 yet but still) For me it was a thing that could be fixed by mentioning/acknowledging/honoring Han in some way and actually showing how Jason Statham was being controled by Cypher in the Tokyo Drift scene much like Dom had his car hooked up to cameras and GPS and was being ordered by Cypher via mini screen to do stuff or else...

 

Okay I get that but it would have been a lot easier for the audience, in my opinion, to get behind this if after the reveal that he is basically the British Hobbs that he went to Letty and had a moment with her in which he actually apologized for the murder of their family members. Because they were the ones who yelled at him when he showed up and never get a moment of clarity or peace, only Hobbs and Dom get that.

 

Yes, also that!

 

Yeah they all had earpieces.

 

Also with the competition for affection for Ramsay between Tyrese and Ludacris, am I the only one that was waiting for her at the end to tell them that she was a lesbian? I liked her tripping them up with the "what's my last name" question but it just means that we get more uncomfortable courting in the sequels.

 

Kind of like the ending of "Dodgeball"??? (I know in that she turns out to be bisexual)

 

I love Jason Statham and I'm always happy to see him in anything, but I cannot believe the gang's all cool with him and he's invited to the cookout. #Justice4Han

 

 

She was laughably bad and I don't understand any of her acting choices.

 

Acting wise she was fine but for like 80% of the film she seems so unaffected/unphased and cold hearted, and in the airplane headquarters pulling the strings so, IMHO, I missed her skillful and resorceful, no nonsense, multi-layered, hands on attitude her Furiosa character had... #adjectives

 

 

 

P.S.: I disliked the fake NYC rooftop B.B.Q. skyline C.G.I. effect... That's the risk of having High Definition imagery, some things are so perfect and detailed that the eye knows that is fake (I know they can't shoot on location because people in the adjacent buildings can/could see them shooting the end scene)

 

 

It gave me "The Room" P.T.S.D.

 

[FisterRoboto 7499]

Nah I disagree I think that the ending of 7 ended an era with Paul dying and that 5-7 was a trilogy. This now starts the beginning of the team without him.

I don't think anything falls into the "trilogy" archetype. 1, 2, and 4 certainly don't strike me as any kind of a trilogy, unless you're saying they're the "Pre-Rock" movies. But all three of them feel like very different movies, so there's nothing even really tying them together thematically.

 

I could see 5-7 as sort of "Brian and Mia's Story" because 5 is when they announce she's pregnant, and 7 is where he leaves the gang to be with his family.

 

But I could also see 6-8 as a "Shaw family" trilogy.

 

Again, though, that's if you force the trilogy archetype onto these. Overall, I think they're largely standalone adventures.

[FisterRoboto 7499]

 

Theyd be dumb if they dont do that.

Almost as dumb as not calling it F8 of the Furious

 

 

 

Or Infuri8ed

 

 

[NundercoverBrother 174]

For Jason - How to turn over a car from under the hood:

 

http://www.mgexp.com/phorum/read.php?1,1885406

[FisterRoboto 7499]

I don't want this to sound nitpicky (but I know I will) I just didn't quite get that from what the 8th movie showed us. Also Jasons Statham epic monologue/speech to his comatose brother from the hospital scene opening of F7 is pointless if he was really seeking revenge on Cypher (Granted they had not written part 8 yet but still) For me it was a thing that could be fix by mentioning/acknowledging/honoring Han in some way and actually showing how Jason Statham was being controled by Cypher in the Tokyo Drift scene much like Dom had his car hooked up to cameras and GPS and was being ordered by Cypher mini screen to do stuff or else...

I don't think he knew at the time that Cipher was pulling the strings. But the opening is what gives me pause about the whole "Owen Shaw is really a good guy" thing. He basically blows up an entire fucking hospital full of people who are just there to keep his brother alive. He's clearly on a villainous rampage.

 

 

(Sorry for all the double-posts y'all. I have a lot to say about this movie/series that I've been holding in for a couple weeks)

[taylor anne photo 11311]

Okay y'all it's time for the much anticipated THIS WEEK IN FEMINISM!

 

Today I'm going to talk about how all of the THREE women in the Family are treated.

 

I'll start with the biggie, and I have to shout out Elektra Boogaloo for starting this conversation on the first page because it really is so bonkers.

 

Elena only exists for Dom's character development and the fact that they thought they could get away with that kind of shit in the year 2017 without having their asses called out is mind blowing to me. Now I've only seen 6,7, and now 8 all the way through so I can't comment on her character before these movies, but from what I've seen Elena really doesn't fucking do anything except provide some useless love triangle bull shit that never even really pans out. What I've seen is that she protects Mia in 6, protects Hobbs's daughter in 7, and is the damsel in distress in 8? She's a fucking cop that is at the same level as Hobbs and she's thrown to the background in all these fuckin movies I've seen her in. Like I've genuinely never seen her do anything bad ass and that's just a disservice to her and Elsa Pataky. And for them to have the gall to use her as an object in this fucking movie offends me more than anything this series has done.

 

I don't care if it brought out some actual good acting out of Vin Diesel there's literally a million other things they could do besides throwing a bull shit plot about Elena magically having a baby when there's no possible way she was even pregnant and then murdering her. It infuriates me.

 

On to Ramsey - It REALLY bothers me that Roman and Tej fighting for affections without even a word from her about the entire thing until the last scene of the movie is played off as this funny joke. In 7 it was funny a couple of times (although the ogling her body as she walked up the beach made me uncomfortable) but after that it's like, "Okay we get it, she's really hot and you both want to bang her." I thought a much better line for her instead of asking, "What's my last name," would have been "I like girls you dweebs." That way it would cut this fucking shit out and introduce a LGBTQA character all at the same time. But as of now it's as if she has no choice in the matter and one of these two aholes are going to have her. She's not a prize to be won she's a fucking human being.

 

Letty - I actually don't have a ton for her because I definitely feel like Michelle Rodriguez has a bit more control over how badass Letty gets to be because of her action movie history, however, there are a lot of times that make me go ew no Letty get away from Dom. Maybe that's because I agree with Tomspanks that Vin Diesel is the epitome of a cold shower and because I know that Michelle Rodriguez is a queer woman who has dated Cara Delevinge. But maybe it's because I feel Vin Diesel just neeeeds to exert dominance in every way he can. Idk it just seems odd that Dom had this relationship with Elena, dumps her the moment Letty came back, never mentions her to Letty, and then hands her this baby like "Congrats you're a mom now cause Elena is dead." I totally concur with June that she looked less than pleased about this situation and I believe it's because Dom is a fucking HORRIBLE communicator in every way possible lol.

 

Also am I wrong in thinking Nobody pointed at Tej and said he was higher on the Most Wanted list than Letty??? Cause that just does NOT seem possible to me.

 

Look, am I expecting this to be the shining beacon for women's rights? Absolutely not. But for a franchise that is this successful, that didn't even feature a single white person on their main theatrical poster, that does incorporate such inclusiveness when it comes to races and showing what the world ACTUALLY looks like, you would at least hope they would treat the women in their "family" with a little more respect.

[FisterRoboto 7499]

Elena only exists for Dom's character development and the fact that they thought they could get away with that kind of shit in the year 2017 without having their asses called out is mind blowing to me. Now I've only seen 6,7, and now 8 all the way through so I can't comment on her character before these movies, but from what I've seen Elena really doesn't fucking do anything except provide some useless love triangle bull shit that never even really pans out. What I've seen is that she protects Mia in 6, protects Hobbs's daughter in 7, and is the damsel in distress in 8? She's a fucking cop that is at the same level as Hobbs and she's thrown to the background in all these fuckin movies I've seen her in. Like I've genuinely never seen her do anything bad ass and that's just a disservice to her and Elsa Pataky. And for them to have the gall to use her as an object in this fucking movie offends me more than anything this series has done.

This is exactly what I was hoping for when you mentioned there was going to be a This Week in Feminism post.

 

She's actually pretty good in Fast Five. Hobbs picks her as the one honest cop he can trust in Brazil, and she gets to work with the crew.

 

I've been disappointed that they haven't used her as much since then. Then they introduce her here just to fucking fridge her (which was obvious as soon as they showed her the first time). I was pretty upset about that, too.

 

Maybe that's because I agree with Tomspanks that Vin Diesel is the epitome of a cold shower and because I know that Michelle Rodriguez is a queer woman who has dated Cara Delevinge.

I mean, she did also date Vin Diesel IRL... (not that that negates your other points)

[RyanSz 3140]

 

Also am I wrong in thinking Nobody pointed at Tej and said he was higher on the Most Wanted list than Letty??? Cause that just does NOT seem possible to me.

The only reason I can see him higher on the list was because of the wrecking ball stunt that he set off which if that didn't kill some dudes, I would be amazed.

[taylor anne photo 11311]

This is exactly what I was hoping for when you mentioned there was going to be a This Week in Feminism post.

 

She's actually pretty good in Fast Five. Hobbs picks her as the one honest cop he can trust in Brazil, and she gets to work with the crew.

 

I've been disappointed that they haven't used her as much since then. Then they introduce her here just to fucking fridge her (which was obvious as soon as they showed her the first time). I was pretty upset about that, too.

I need to go on a hunt for all the movies now and just complete the series lol.

 

I mean, she did also date Vin Diesel IRL... (not that that negates your other points)

MICHELLE WHYYYYYY

 

That is just so unbelievable to me lol like omg no why. Okay maybe it's my feelings about Vin Diesel as a love interest that makes me want Letty to get away from him lol.

[NundercoverBrother 174]

Scott Eastwood was on the Joe Rogan Experience a few weeks ago and said they destroyed 700 cars in the movie.

Majority of them in that NY scene.

[NundercoverBrother 174]

The Second Opinion song this week was Gee Dee Amazing

[ilovebacon 8]

 

^^Here's video of the cars falling scene filmed last year here in Cleveland- no cgi, they just tossed the cars out the windows... hooray for practical effects!

[FisterRoboto 7499]

Okay, so I don't think the baby timeline is all that crazy. Here we go:

 

Fast Five - Dom and Elena meet. She somehow falls in love with him when he comes to get his cross back from her apartment and puts his fucking sausage fingers over her mouth.

 

Fast Six - Opens with Dom and Elena in bed together. Sometime here or slightly before is when she got pregnant. The movie takes place over a couple weeks.

 

Tokyo Drift - Move takes place over...let's say a year and a half (there's no clear indicator, but that would make sense for Han to move over to Tokyo, set up his operation, and train that hillbilly shitlord Lucas Black). The baby is born, and Elena starts back to work. Assuming she's just barely pregnant at the beginning of Fast Six, that would make the baby roughly 9 months old by the end of this movie.

 

Furious 7 - Takes place immediately after TD. Assuming 3 months of maternity leave, Elena has been back at work for about 6 months at this point, and the baby is still roughly 9 months old. The movie takes place over a matter of weeks. Hell, to be generous, let's call it a month (although I think it's more likely closer to 10 days or so). Baby's age at end of movie: ~10 months

 

Fate of the Furious - Baby is roughly 10 months old.

 

Boom.

 

And I know people are going to be like, "Why didn't she mention it to Dom in the hospital in 7?"

 

Two things:

1. Hobbs is injured, and he's there to see him

2. She's still wrestling over whether or not she should even tell him.

 

(And also, they hadn't come up with the idea of the baby yet)

[taylor anne photo 11311]

I don't think anything falls into the "trilogy" archetype. 1, 2, and 4 certainly don't strike me as any kind of a trilogy, unless you're saying they're the "Pre-Rock" movies. But all three of them feel like very different movies, so there's nothing even really tying them together thematically.

 

I could see 5-7 as sort of "Brian and Mia's Story" because 5 is when they announce she's pregnant, and 7 is where he leaves the gang to be with his family.

 

But I could also see 6-8 as a "Shaw family" trilogy.

 

Again, though, that's if you force the trilogy archetype onto these. Overall, I think they're largely standalone adventures.

See I haven't seen 1-4 (or more than 30 minutes of 5) to comment on that part of it. But I think because of Brian and Mia that's why I felt like that was a trilogy. I mean the whole thing is connected in such a way that none of them can really be placed in groups other than 5 on totally took a turn to where they realized what they had and ran with it.

[FisterRoboto 7499]

I need to go on a hunt for all the movies now and just complete the series lol.

I bought the newest box set. It's glorious.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Cameron H. 23786]

For all of you waiting patiently, here's my next poem! (No, I was not joking. And, yes, I'm really doing this)

 

This one is for Letty. It doesn't have a title because it was done in the style of Emily Dickinson.

 

 

Upon this dusty road

Dark-feathered Phoenix fly -

A dram of Dom upon your lips -

Into his arms you Die -

 

Forget not this, Your Name

On Streets of Fire Burns -

Wars of Race you Rage against -

The Smell of Skank you Spurn

 

Fearless Fighter flying

On Veins of Liquid Gold -

A Woman set upon a Mission

To light her Darkened Soul

 

Roadblocks lay in Ruins -

Beneath Her booted feet -

As tank-topped asservations

Await Her down the Street

[FisterRoboto 7499]

here in Cleveland

You mean they didn't ACTUALLY do it in Times Square?

 

I call shenanigans!

[Smigg 1488]

Jason brought up the guys from The Raid in reference to any potential Hand-to-Hand combat scenes, forgetting that Joe Taslim (who was the badass Police Sergeant "Jaka" in the first Raid movie) was in Fast 6.

 

And then Tony Jaa from Ong Bak was in Furious 7, who has featured in some of the best fight scenes in history, especially when you watch The Protector (or 'Warrior King' as it was called here in the UK), his staircase fight scene was all one shot, and was just beautiful. Not only that, there was the legendary "bone breaking scene", where Jaa's character fucks up what must have been 50 henchmen.

 

It goes to show you how underutilised those guys were, when people can't even remember that they were in them.

[FisterRoboto 7499]

Jason brought up the guys from The Raid in reference to any potential Hand-to-Hand combat scenes, forgetting that Joe Taslim (who was the badass Police Sergeant "Jaka" in the first Raid movie) was in Fast 6.

 

And then Tony Jaa from Ong Bak was in Furious 7, who has featured in some of the best fight scenes in history, especially when you watch The Protector (or 'Warrior King' as it was called here in the UK), his staircase fight scene was all one shot, and was just beautiful, and not long after that, there was the legendary "bone breaking scene", where Jaa's character fucks up what must have been 100 henchmen.

 

They really wasted those guys.

Vin also had Jaa in the latest xXx, and they totally wasted him there, too, because Donnie Yen 100% outshines him.

[IMAHUGEHDTGMFAN 1837]

(To mirror Fisters words) Sorry for multi posting...

 

Another 2 Omissions (sorta) ...

 

*As Paul said in the F7 HDTGM episode the audience questions and the gang predicted Charlize and Helen Mirren in F8.. But also what Paul said about the Universal high contact info about "not losing fights" in the cast contracts was also true (Prison fight between Hobbs & Shaw = Draw, Letty fighting that bearded mustached stuntman from John Wick 1, Equalizer, Jurassic World, The Accountant = Letty Wins "In a propeller fight, the propeller ALWAYS wins...", Hobbs against 2 or more = Hobbs wins, Roman alone in the ice against like 6 dudes = BOOOM! Headshots! x 6 Shaw + baby against Cypher's plane goons = Double Win)

 

*In part 6 the actor who played the Shaw crewmember named Jah was from "The Raid: Redemption" he kicked Han's and Roman's butts at the Underground station and back then Jason spoted him, In this ep. he wanted the fighting style from those films in the series from now on... And I'm with him

[Cameron H. 23786]

 

2. She's still wrestling over whether or not she should even tell him.

 

I think this is it. I was watching 7 this morning (for poetry research) and it definitely seemed like she wanted to tell him something. Just as she's about to, he gets called in to see Hobbs. Considering it's the same writer, I can definitely believe that her pregnancy was always the intention, or at least it was his intention when he wrote the hospital scene.

[FisterRoboto 7499]

Also, all this talk about The Rock vs Vin Diesel hotness, and y'all missed the sexiest fucking dude in the movie...

 

 

 

 

Not even joking. Kristofer Hivju <3 <3 <3 <3

 

 

 

And, unrelated, but I have to say I wasn't into the Kid Rock-style intro until they got to the "Where does the butt start" line. Also, that theme should only be played with Jason's giggles in it.

[Smigg 1488]

They should draft in Iko Uwais (the main guy from The Raid) as well. I knew of him before The Raid in a movie called "Merantau Warrior", if you haven't seen it, just imagine Indonesian Ong Bak, but with Pencak Silat instead of Muay Thai/Muay Boran.

 

In fact, go all the way and bring in Yayan Ruhian who starred with Iko Uwais in Merantau Warrior and both Raid movies, as well as Star Wars: The Force Awakens as Tasu Leech.