Singin’ In The Rain

[JulyDiaz 2797]

Amy & Paul tap, swing and two-step through 1952's meta-musical Singin' In The Rain! They are dazzled by the film's stylized color, dive into its perspective on honesty in Hollywood, and hear Lena Lamont's real voice. Plus: dancer & choreographer Sarah Reich drops by the show to talk about the art of tap!

 

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[grudlian. 4725]

I feel the need to back up Paul's opinion that the Broadway Melody because I've definitely been judged for also thinking it doesn't really belong in Singin' In The Rain. It's great sequence but it doesn't make any sense in the movie at all. Every time I watch Singin' In The Rain, I always forget it's there until it's on. But I think of every other scene in Singin' In The Rain when the movie comes up.

And I really really want to back up everything Amy said about La La Land. It's fine but never totally bowled me over.

Also, a very obscure cameo in the movie is Snub Pollard who's probably best known as the villain in a bunch of Harold Lloyd. He's apparently the guy Gene hands the umbrella to at the end of the Singin' In The Rain sequence.

[Cameron H. 23786]

2 hours ago, grudlian. said:

I feel the need to back up Paul's opinion that the Broadway Melody because I've definitely been judged for also thinking it doesn't really belong in Singin' In The Rain. It's great sequence but it doesn't make any sense in the movie at all. Every time I watch Singin' In The Rain, I always forget it's there until it's on. But I think of every other scene in Singin' In The Rain when the movie comes up.

Whenever I think of that scene, I think of a conversation I had with a Theater Major friend of mine back in college.* We were talking about Romeo & Juliet, and the magnificence of Mercutio, when the subject of the "Queen Mab" speech came up. We both loved that speech, but what my friend said she liked the most about it was that it was pretty much Shakespeare writing something "because he could." Yes, it helps establish Mercutio as Romeo's foil, but he could have just as eaisly said, "Hey, bud, dreams are dumb." Instead, you get this incredibly poetic monologue that's there...just because. For me, that's what the Broadway Melody is. It doesn't really tell us anything we don't already know. It's there because Gene Kelly "could."

Paul also says that it doesn't make sense for the movie they are supposedly making and that it should have been Debbie Reynolds instead of Cyd Charrise. I mean, their idea for the Dancing Cavalier is pretty suspect, but the way I rationalized it is that in the modern part of the movie, Kelly's character is falling for the wrong woman so that he can be available for Lamont's character in the time-travelling sequence.

Besides, it can't be Debbie because she's not even supposed to be working on the film  

*Incidentally, this was the same friend who introduced me to Singin’ in the Rain 

[Cam Bert 8145]

I have to admit that I was falling pretty much along the lines of thinking with Paul for the most of it. Make Them Laugh is the best number in the movie and Broadway Melody while a great dance number does feel a bit long and self indulgent in this movie. Now like my fellow Cameron pointed out there is nothing wrong with something existing because they could and that doesn't take away from the beauty of the number. However, as a certain point I can't help but start to think "Wow, this is still going on" and awhile later "Wow, this is still going on." I just want to get back to the fun of the characters interacting and as a result the number over stays its welcome a bit.

[sycasey 2.0 2301]

[taylor anne photo 11311]

Fuck - Debbie Reynolds

Marry - Gene Kelly

Kill - Donald O'Conner (also because he's the only one left sorry lol)

[AlmostAGhost 2718]

I didn't like it all that much, AMA

[Cameron H. 23786]

I'm about 20 minutes from the end of the episode, so I apologize if this gets brought up, but I wanted to get it off my chest. Did anyone else kind of feel bad for Lamont? I mean, by the end she's definitely the villain, but up until then I felt the movie was pretty unsympathetic to her character. It's not her fault that her skill set didn't lend itself to "talkies." Her career is going down the tubes and everyone just makes fun of her for being delusion, untalented, and dumb. 

One part that really got me was when Zelda rats out Don and the gang to Lamont and Don says something sarcastically like, "You're a real pal, Zelda...." Um, hey asshole, she is! To Lamont! While you were busy trying to undermine Lamont's career, she was telling her friend what you're up to. 

Zelda = Good Friend. 

[Cam Bert 8145]

Just now, AlmostAGhost said:

I didn't like it all that much, AMA

Ha! I was waiting for you to show up because I was curious. What would you say your major complaint is?

[taylor anne photo 11311]

2 minutes ago, AlmostAGhost said:

I didn't like it all that much, AMA

[grudlian. 4725]

33 minutes ago, CameronH said:

Whenever I think of that scene, I think of a conversation I had with a Theater Major friend of mine back in college.* We were talking about Romeo & Juliet and the magnificence of Mercutio when the subject of the "Queen Mab" speech came up. We both loved that speech, but what my friend said she liked the most about it was that it was pretty much Shakespeare writing something "because he could." Yes, it helps establish Mercutio as Romeo's foil, but he could have just as eaisly said, "Hey, bud, dreams are dumb." Instead, you get this incredibly poetic monologue that's there...just because. For me, that's what the Broadway Melody is. It doesn't really tell us anything we don't already know. It's there because Gene Kelly "could."

Paul also says that it doesn't make sense for the movie they are supposedly making and that it should have been Debbie Reynolds instead of Cyd Charrise. I mean, their idea for the Dancing Cavalier is pretty suspect, but the way I rationalized it is that in the modern part of the movie, Kelly's character is falling for the wrong woman so that he can be available for Lamont's character in the time-travelling sequence..

Besides, it can't be Debbie anyway because she's not even supposed to be working on the film  

*Incidentally, this was the same friend who introduced me to Singin’ in the Rain 

This is pretty much exactly what Broadway Melody is. Gene Kelly could. It's still a great sequence but I will always feel it doesn't quite fit. I'm not saying the movie would be better without the sequence (I wouldn't miss but I'm glad I can see it). It's just a very lengthy scene that also doesn't fit the tone of the rest of the movie.

[Cam Bert 8145]

26 minutes ago, CameronH said:

I'm about 20 minutes from the end of the episode, so I apologize if this gets brought up, but I wanted to get it off my chest. Did anyone else kind of feel bad for Lamont? I mean, by the end she's definitely the villain, but up until then I felt the movie was pretty unsympathetic to her character. It's not her fault that her skill set didn't lend itself to "talkies." Her career is going down the tubes and everyone just makes fun of her for being delusion, untalented, and dumb. 

One part that really got me was when Zelda rats out Don and the gang to Lamont and Don says something sarcastically like, "You're a real pal, Zelda...." Um, hey asshole, she is! To Lamont! While you're busy trying to undermine Lamont career, she's telling her friend what you're up to. 

Zelda = Good Friend. 

From her point of view some of the things she does is to help her and Lockwood's career. Yes she seems jealous that he talks to other women, but that is because the studio is selling stories to the tabloids that him and her and an item. If he's out talking to other ladies it looks bad for them both as rumors would then come out in the tabloids that they aren't an item. Who knows how that would have effected their pre-talkies careers? Their partnership would have ended and they might not have had chemistry with their new studio assigned co-star and they wouldn't have needed the talkies to ruin their career. 

[grudlian. 4725]

15 minutes ago, taylorannephoto said:

Fuck - Debbie Reynolds

Marry - Gene Kelly

Kill - Donald O'Conner (also because he's the only one left sorry lol)

Fuck Gene

Marry Debbie

Kill Donald. I'm so sorry Donald but you're the only one left. 

13 minutes ago, AlmostAGhost said:

I didn't like it all that much, AMA

Do you hate joy?

[Cam Bert 8145]

I am sadden by all this Donald killing. I'd kill Gene Kelly in a heart beat and then have a real hard time deciding  between Debbie and Donald as to which to marry.

[AlmostAGhost 2718]

21 minutes ago, Cam Bert said:

Ha! I was waiting for you to show up because I was curious. What would you say your major complaint is?

I guess mainly the idea that the songs came first, before the story.  That rubs me the wrong way, and I don't think it's me, I think it shows in the film - that's why most of the songs don't really fit at all (e.g., why we're immediately discussing the Broadway Melody scene). It's a fine movie, but top 5 of all time?  TOP 5?  It never feels that unique to me.  Yes, it is charming and the dancing is awesome.  That's why I gave it 3 stars.  But 1952 is way too late to be all wowed by colors in a film.

And no, I don't hate joy.  Everyone's all "it's so happy"... but is it?  It is about destroying a good actress' reputation, and there seems to be a message that the audience is dopes ("to save this bad story we'll put songs in it" and then, yup, everyone loves it).  I'm pretty sure The Dancing Cavalier was the Titanic of its day.

Anyway, I was mainly joking about AMA -- I really don't want to take over a thread when everyone else is feeling it.

[taylor anne photo 11311]

7 minutes ago, Cam Bert said:

I am sadden by all this Donald killing. I'd kill Gene Kelly in a heart beat and then have a real hard time deciding  between Debbie and Donald as to which to marry.

I don't want to actually kill Donald. I've just had such a situation for Gene Kelly for decades now.

[taylor anne photo 11311]

49 minutes ago, Cam Bert said:

I have to admit that I was falling pretty much along the lines of thinking with Paul for the most of it. Make Them Laugh is the best number in the movie and Broadway Melody while a great dance number does feel a bit long and self indulgent in this movie. Now like my fellow Cameron pointed out there is nothing wrong with something existing because they could and that doesn't take away from the beauty of the number. However, as a certain point I can't help but start to think "Wow, this is still going on" and awhile later "Wow, this is still going on." I just want to get back to the fun of the characters interacting and as a result the number over stays its welcome a bit.

I couldn't agree more. To me, it feels like it goes on for so long that you've just watched an entirely new movie, which you pretty much do, but it's not like the tl'dr version it's the actual movie. It also kinda bugs me that it suddenly becomes modern 1950s looking. To me, that would be like if The Nice Guys, set in 1970s LA, suddenly had a 2017 dream sequence, which would completely kill the vibe for me. I absolutely LOVE it on it's own merit, because it's a gorgeous sequence and displays so many amazing things at once, but I'm not entirely convinced it belongs in this specific movie.

That being said, I have no idea what they could've done any differently.

[Msmvnj 1]

How can a tap dancer not cite Moses Supposes as an incredible number? Yeah, Make Em Laugh is a blast, but for technique and skill, you can’t touch Moses.

[Msmvnj 1]

I’d fuck and marry Gene, kill Debbie. Donald can come over to dinner.

[taylor anne photo 11311]

 

The preview completely ruins the surprise but seeing the transition from Singin In The Rain to Umbrella is absolutely worth the watch.

[Msmvnj 1]

BTW Fred wasn’t all that sweet The truth about Fred & Ginger https://www.express.co.uk/expressyourself/138076/Fred-and-Ginger-The-truth/amp

[grudlian. 4725]

24 minutes ago, AlmostAGhost said:

I guess mainly the idea that the songs came first, before the story.  That rubs me the wrong way, and I don't think it's me, I think it shows in the film - that's why most of the songs don't really fit at all (e.g., why we're immediately discussing the Broadway Melody scene). It's a fine movie, but top 5 of all time?  TOP 5?  It never feels that unique to me.  Yes, it is charming and the dancing is awesome.  That's why I gave it 3 stars.  But 1952 is way too late to be all wowed by colors in a film.

And no, I don't hate joy.  Everyone's all "it's so happy"... but is it?  It is about destroying a good actress' reputation, and there seems to be a message that the audience is dopes ("to save this bad story we'll put songs in it" and then, yup, everyone loves it).  I'm pretty sure The Dancing Cavalier was the Titanic of its day.

Anyway, I was mainly joking about AMA -- I really don't want to take over a thread when everyone else is feeling it.

I'm fine hearing dissenting opinions.

I get a bit of your criticism. This really is just a jukebox musical which has a negative connotation today but I think most people don't know the songs outside of this movie. So, people literally don't know this is old music even in the 1950s.

I don't know people are necessarily wowed by color in the film unless I'm listening your post. The colors look great but I don't think 1952 audiences were shocked like Wizard of Oz. Maybe I'm wrong about that. I'd say it's similar to watching something like In The Mood For Love. I love the color in that film but I'm not wowed color exists in a movie. 

You're right about this being kind of not a joyful plot. They are ruining her career because of her voice. I mean she's a jerk so maybe that kind of justifies it? Not really but this is the ultimate turn your brain off and just enjoy it movie.

[AlmostAGhost 2718]

It's hard to be a the one dissenter sometime, I don't want to sound like I'm just crapping on stuff people like. I know we're all here to discuss! It's just a line that's hard to get right, and I'm uber-aware of it (as someone who runs a FB music fan group and have to deal with that sometimes).

The colors thing was basically an oversimplification - the best thing to me was the art/direction of the film, I'll add.  But some of those art things just feel very nostalgic, as opposed to remotely fresh - I'm thinking the colors, the songs, the costumes, the sets. Even the dancing, really. It's all just old.  If this movie came out 20 years earlier, I think the reception would be more apt.

(Though I was interested to learn and note from Paul and Amy how Kelly directed the dancing was unique, comparing it to dancing with the camera.)

 

[taylor anne photo 11311]

4 minutes ago, AlmostAGhost said:

It's hard to be a the one dissenter sometime, I don't want to sound like I'm just crapping on stuff people like. I know we're all here to discuss! It's just a line that's hard to get right, and I'm uber-aware of it (as someone who runs a FB music fan group and have to deal with that sometimes)

I think it's hard to be the one man out in any direction tbh. It was honestly difficult for me to be the one person that loves Titanic still in a sea of people being like nope lol.

[Cameron H. 23786]

1 minute ago, AlmostAGhost said:

It's hard to be a the one dissenter sometime, I don't want to sound like I'm just crapping on stuff people like. I know we're all here to discuss! It's just a line that's hard to get right, and I'm uber-aware of it (as someone who runs a FB music fan group and have to deal with that sometimes).

 

I, for one, encourage differing opinions.  As long as it's being done respectfully (which I feel like everyone here has always done), it allows people to get into really talking about the movie, song, television show, etc.  If we're all just going to sit here and heap praise (or shit on) a movie, then it's not really a discussion - it's stagnation. I don't think a person can really get to the bottom of why something is good or bad until they are asked to defend their opinion. I know some people don't like that kind of push (I've seen people leave the boards just for being asked to defend their position), but in a healthy atmosphere - which I think we all try to foster here - I see absolutely nothing wrong with it.