Episode 202.5 - Minisode 202.5

[JulyDiaz 2797]

What’s the best Rocky movie? Listen and find out on this week’s minisode! Paul goest through Corrections and Omissions for Look Who’s Talking Now, opens up the Mail Bag, and ranks all the Rocky movies. Plus, find out which movie will be covered next week!

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[grudlian. 4725]

I have some real issues with Paul's ranking of the Rocky movies. I do appreciate him putting Rocky 4 near the bottom where it belongs though. I'll probably get into it more during the Unspooled board during Rocky.

[grudlian. 4725]

It looks like Perfect Stranger is free to stream on hoopladigital.com if your library or school uses that resource.

[tomspanks 9039]

Big spoiler for the Rocky movies in this ep, in case anyone hasn't seen them all.  Like me.  

[JusMishMash224 62]

Hi! Did Paul Post the RAD car from the LA/Hollywood Parade? thx

[Cameron H. 23786]

Um, BREAKING NEWS, Daredevil has been cancelled but...A Christmas Prince: A Royal Wedding was just  been released on Netflix!

I'm happy with this trade.

[babyHelenHunt 0]

Perfect Stranger is also free on tubi  (https://tubitv.com/).

But I believe the movies there can change week to week, and I don't know much about it, outside of Wikipedia. Happy watching!

[Cameron H. 23786]

4 hours ago, babyHelenHunt said:

Perfect Stranger is also free on tubi  (https://tubitv.com/).

But I believe the movies there can change week to week, and I don't know much about it, outside of Wikipedia. Happy watching!

I checked this out earlier (like 5 hours ago) and it was there. I watched through the credits, but was forced to turn it off. I just checked back, and it’s gone

[DrGuts1003 462]

My day has been made...had two of my corrections and omissions discussed by Paul on this episode.  I look forward to contributing more in the future.  Love the show and love this site!

[Cameron H. 23786]

I just want to say that while Tubi TV failed me on Perfect Stranger it has a bunch of Holiday Romances I haven’t seen offered anywhere else. I’m looking forward to diving in. It also has the Dolly Parton movie Unlikely Angel which I’m looking forward to to revisiting.

[RyanSz 3140]

Unfortunately I can remember enough of this that I may not have to rewatch it right away, it's that fucking insane. I remember this getting a lot of promotion at the time because you had two actors still pretty well regarded in Hollywood together for the first time and the premise seemed like a good suspenseful thriller, but boy did they ever shit the bed on this one.

[TomPretty 29]

Which Perfect Stranger? The one with Halle Berry and Bruce Willis?

[JimKata 62]

My Rocky ranking:

Rocky

Rocky V

Rocky II

Creed

Rocky IV

Rocky III

Rocky Balboa

Creed II

[grudlian. 4725]

2 hours ago, TomPretty said:

Which Perfect Stranger? The one with Halle Berry and Bruce Willis?

Yes

[RyanSz 3140]

Rocky Ranking for me would be this order:

1. Rocky

2. Creed

3.  Rocky II

4. Creed II

5. Rocky Balboa

6. Rocky IV

7. Rocky III

8. Rocky V

 

Also since this is my 3,000th post I make my official request for an episode to either be Last Action Hero or Ready to Rumble, because how those two films haven't been covered yet is mind boggling.

[Quasar Sniffer 4174]

Although Paul has some... interesting opinions about the Rocky films (the first one being boring?!?!? After all the HDTGM snoozers we've slogged through, to call ROCKY boring....) the most egregious is saying that Stallone never got in shape as Rocky. PURE MADNESS

[Cameron H. 23786]

58 minutes ago, Quasar Sniffer said:

Although Paul has some... interesting opinions about the Rocky films (the first one being boring?!?!? After all the HDTGM snoozers we've slogged through, to call ROCKY boring....) the most egregious is saying that Stallone never got in shape as Rocky. PURE MADNESS

I remember watching the Rocky movies for the first time (and out of order  ) when I was around 11 or 12, and I remember thinking the first one was kind of boring. However, I realize now how wrong I was. Rocky is a perfect movie. (2-4 are dumb fun. 5-6 I don’t remember well enough, but I don’t remember hating them) 

I’ve only seen the first Creed, but I kind of feel like if we don’t want him to live forever in Rocky’s shadow, the character deserves to be ranked on his own.

[RyanSz 3140]

That's sort of why I have 1 and 2 of each series bouncing between each other, because of how well the character arcs mirror each other. If any of the Rocky film were to be called boring it would be V because it really isn't a boxing movie so much as a family drama, topped with a horrible street fight at the end. 3-4 are the uber 80s versions of the series complete with friendship beach runs, robots, and taking down the Soviet Union, while Balboa mixes the family drama of V with the heart and boxing of I. Stallone plays the character, based on Chuck Wepner, to a T and it's in that first movie you see as complete a movie as you can see, especially from a first time writer. Creed II is surprisingly good, especially after how incredibly the first was, basically blending elements of Rocky II-IV, but making it unique in that it isn't just a Rocky/Adonis story, but also a Ivan/Viktor story, where the viewer gets this incredible ying-yang type story where in essence Viktor is playing the same role Rocky did in the first two Rocky films, albeit as the aggressor in the coupling.

[Quasar Sniffer 4174]

3 hours ago, RyanSz said:

That's sort of why I have 1 and 2 of each series bouncing between each other, because of how well the character arcs mirror each other. If any of the Rocky film were to be called boring it would be V because it really isn't a boxing movie so much as a family drama, topped with a horrible street fight at the end. 3-4 are the uber 80s versions of the series complete with friendship beach runs, robots, and taking down the Soviet Union, while Balboa mixes the family drama of V with the heart and boxing of I. Stallone plays the character, based on Chuck Wepner, to a T and it's in that first movie you see as complete a movie as you can see, especially from a first time writer. Creed II is surprisingly good, especially after how incredibly the first was, basically blending elements of Rocky II-IV, but making it unique in that it isn't just a Rocky/Adonis story, but also a Ivan/Viktor story, where the viewer gets this incredible ying-yang type story where in essence Viktor is playing the same role Rocky did in the first two Rocky films, albeit as the aggressor in the coupling.

I love everything about this post, and I love every Rocky and Creed movie except, you guessed it, Rocky V. That movie, I think, is unnecessarily lambasted, but it's still the weakest of the series by far.

I actually have mixed feelings about Rocky II because I kind of feel like they go too far into making Rocky the butt of jokes, like the film turns him into someone who is clinically mentally disabled, who can't fend for himself. Recently, however, I've been re-evaluating a lot of movies that I have not seen in quite some time (LOTR and Susperia being prominent examples), and since it's been probably a decade since I've seen Rocky II, I think it is time for a re-watch. I will hold off on actually ranking them until that happens.

[grudlian. 4725]

1. Rocky

2. Creed

3. Balboa

4. Rocky II

5. Rocky IV

6. Rocky III

7. Rocky V

I'm seeing Creed 2 tomorrow. So, I still don't have a ranking but I'm going in cautiously optimistic.

I think Balboa, until Creed came out, is the first Rocky sequel that got what made Rocky so special. It's got the drama, the heart, the emotion that separates it from the hundred other sports movies that all follow the same formula. The problem is you can't really have Balboa without at least a few of the sequels.

Rocky IV is debateably the worst of the series. It's only better than III and V because it gets so goofy that it turns laughably good in parts. The robot alone is practically a joke. It would be impressive now. Let alone 30 years ago.

[grudlian. 4725]

My main problem with Rocky II is that Rocky wins. It works emotionally but is this even plausible? The first movie works because Apollo is basically expecting an exhibition. He hasn't properly trained. He's not the mentally.

But could Apollo the heavyweight champion go into Rocky II against a nobody and realistically lose? I admit I don't know anything about boxing but is there a real world analogue to this at all? Anything even close to this happening?

[Quasar Sniffer 4174]

8 minutes ago, grudlian. said:

My main problem with Rocky II is that Rocky wins. It works emotionally but is this even plausible? The first movie works because Apollo is basically expecting an exhibition. He hasn't properly trained. He's not the mentally.

But could Apollo the heavyweight champion go into Rocky II against a nobody and realistically lose? I admit I don't know anything about boxing but is there a real world analogue to this at all? Anything even close to this happening?

My thoughts on his victory is that age caught up with Creed, which is why his fight with Drago was so ill-advised in IV (he was so passed his prime at that point, he was bound to get hurt against a killing machine like Drago). Part of why I love the mythology about the two Rocky/Creed matches is that the two never fought each other at their prime; with Rocky reaching his zenith in his fight with Creed in II just as Creed was losing a step or two. By IV, Rocky has become Captain America or something, so logic no longer factors into his ability to match fists with other boxers. That's part of the fun of it, but it's never going to be as emotionally engaging.

[RyanSz 3140]

8 hours ago, Quasar Sniffer said:

I love everything about this post, and I love every Rocky and Creed movie except, you guessed it, Rocky V. That movie, I think, is unnecessarily lambasted, but it's still the weakest of the series by far.

I actually have mixed feelings about Rocky II because I kind of feel like they go too far into making Rocky the butt of jokes, like the film turns him into someone who is clinically mentally disabled, who can't fend for himself. Recently, however, I've been re-evaluating a lot of movies that I have not seen in quite some time (LOTR and Susperia being prominent examples), and since it's been probably a decade since I've seen Rocky II, I think it is time for a re-watch. I will hold off on actually ranking them until that happens.

Rocky II in a way continues the story of what actually happened to the guy that Rocky is based on, who tried to turn his fame from both his fight with Muhammad Ali and this movie into a cash grab, and only became more destitute in the end, so much so he was reduced to freak show fights to earn a living like when he boxed a bear, I would have loved to see Rocky do,  although they did recreate Wepner's fight with Andre the Giant by having Rocky fight Hulk Hogan in Rocky III. Though they went for a happier ending in the film for the reasons that have been stated, it is a big step up from one of the original endings for Rocky which saw him die in the ring because his body couldn't handle the onslaught of a world class athlete. Also if you haven't watched the movie Chuck, starring Liev Schreiber as Chuck Wepner, do so as it's a great biopic about a man who's story we all know because it belongs to someone else at this point.

5 hours ago, grudlian. said:

1. Rocky

2. Creed

3. Balboa

4. Rocky II

5. Rocky IV

6. Rocky III

7. Rocky V

I'm seeing Creed 2 tomorrow. So, I still don't have a ranking but I'm going in cautiously optimistic.

I think Balboa, until Creed came out, is the first Rocky sequel that got what made Rocky so special. It's got the drama, the heart, the emotion that separates it from the hundred other sports movies that all follow the same formula. The problem is you can't really have Balboa without at least a few of the sequels.

Rocky IV is debateably the worst of the series. It's only better than III and V because it gets so goofy that it turns laughably good in parts. The robot alone is practically a joke. It would be impressive now. Let alone 30 years ago.

Yeah with my rankings, while the top 5 are not tied, the things separating the rankings are razor thin, because I thought Balboa was great and carried the best part of V, his relationship with his son so well. IV is easily the first Rocky movie that should be covered by the show for the fact that Paulie, the most deplorable character in movie history, is fucking the ever loving hell out of that robot to the point where I believe he talks about having its tubes tied. That along with Rocky basically ending the Cold War would make for an amazing live show.

5 hours ago, grudlian. said:

My main problem with Rocky II is that Rocky wins. It works emotionally but is this even plausible? The first movie works because Apollo is basically expecting an exhibition. He hasn't properly trained. He's not the mentally.

But could Apollo the heavyweight champion go into Rocky II against a nobody and realistically lose? I admit I don't know anything about boxing but is there a real world analogue to this at all? Anything even close to this happening?

It is possible because combat sports like boxing and MMA are the epitome of the "any given night" saying because at any point the fight can end, prime examples being Buster Douglass, the 42-1 underdog, being the first man to professionally beat Mike Tyson or Holly Holm, who had just as high of odds, completely starching Ronda Rousey from the opening bell of their fight to when she knocked her into the following week with a headkick. While Chuck Wepner was a nationally ranked heavyweight fighter when he fought Ali for the title, EVERYONE saw the fight as being one of a few warmup fights for Ali to get him ready for his rubber match with Joe Frazier, yet Wepner would shock the world by not only knocking Ali down, one of the few men at the to have accomplished that feat, and then be 19 seconds short of going the distance with arguably the greatest boxer in history before the ref called the fight after an extremely bloodied Wepner got knocked down.

[grudlian. 4725]

I'm just out of Creed II. My current thoughts are that I'd put it above Rocky II but it's been a long time since I've seen it (and I might be running the series this week because there's something about Rocky movies that makes you want to do that). I love how it kind of humanizes Ivan Drago from cartoonish supervillain to, well, probably what a lot of failed (Russian) athletes turn into. I also never realized how much I don't want Phylicia Rashad to be disappointed in me. 

 

That Brigitte Nielsen cameo got me. Her reveal shocked me even though it's stupidly obvious. Especially since I knew Milo Ventimiglia was in it, I was mouth open crying during that scene.

[RyanSz 3140]

5 hours ago, grudlian. said:

I'm just out of Creed II. My current thoughts are that I'd put it above Rocky II but it's been a long time since I've seen it (and I might be running the series this week because there's something about Rocky movies that makes you want to do that). I love how it kind of humanizes Ivan Drago from cartoonish supervillain to, well, probably what a lot of failed (Russian) athletes turn into. I also never realized how much I don't want Phylicia Rashad to be disappointed in me. 

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That Brigitte Nielsen cameo got me. Her reveal shocked me even though it's stupidly obvious. Especially since I knew Milo Ventimiglia was in it, I was mouth open crying during that scene.

See I didn't know they had Milo back so that was a nice surprise and I got the feeling that she was coming when they were first shown at the fancy dinner and there was an open seat. I also feel Stallon is still kinda bitter about their divorce as her character was a sympathetic foil to Drago in Rocky IV, showing concern and compassion in light of Apollo's death, but now she's this cold bitch who literally abandoned her son in a frozen wasteland in Russia, then abandons him during the fight when it's looking like he's going to lose.