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What I keep coming back to as I think about Duck Soup is something Conan said about it being "comedy just for comedy's sake." This was always why I liked Conan's show so much (I grew up on his show, it was huge for me). And it's what I like most about Duck Soup. But Duck Soup is jokes. Funny jokes. Slapstick jokes. Wordplay jokes. Visual film jokes. Mean finger-pointing jokes. Self-deprecatory jokes. Vaudeville, stand-up, situational, improv, musical. You name the type of comedy, they did it and did it better than nearly everyone. It's unbound to logic or story, which sure, is weird and takes getting used to, but pulling that off is WHY this should be on the list, imo. I wouldn't even say it's my favorite comedy, or even top-10, probably due to it just being old; but I think this is such an impressive task to make work, it should be there. There's no Airplane! without it, nor Eddie Murphy's 'too cool for the surroundings' persona, nor Monty Python's punchline-less madness, etc.: all these things we idolize today stem straight from these insane Marx Bros. movies.

Oh my goodness, ditto!! That and Green Bay Packer games. I don't remember my parents really introducing me to any specific movies. My dad isn't a big movie fan (I don't ever remember him going to a movie). My mom didn't so much introduce us to movies except for maybe Wizard of Oz, and I know she looooooved The Jazz Singer and Grease.

Again I wasn't huge on Duck Soup either and you brought up the movie that should go on this list in my opinion over Duck Soup and that is Airplane!. To me these two movie share a lot in common. Both try to cram as many jokes in possible and both are just silly for the sake of being silly. There are scenes of physical comedy and there are scenes of quick replies and word play. However, where I think Airplane! works over Duck Soup is that it is working on many different levels. First off Airplane! hits pretty much every type of comedy. There is at least one joke somewhere in the movie that covers every major style and type of humor. All the actors are slightly different in style of acting. Julie Hagerty and Robert Hayes are heightened comedic performances, Leslie Nielsen and Peter Graves are deadpan and straight, Lloyd Bridges finding a balance in between those. The main difference is there is there is a story and even in the bits of story that would be boring they throw in visual jokes to keep you interested while not taking away from the story or comedy. At its core Airplane! like Duck Soup is just pure comedy and being silly but fills in those gaps where I think Duck Soup falls a bit short.

Absolutely none. Instead of comedies, he introduced me to the exciting world of televised golf.

I think my issue with Duck Soup, and the thing I brought up in my Letterboxd review, is with the countless of movies available to me, I don’t know if it exactly transcends to the point of “best of all time.” It’s great. It’s clever. It’s funny. But as they touched on in the episode, that’s pretty much all its got going on. The acting, direction, and cinematography are all just kind of fine. The plot is basically non-existent. What I expect from a “Best of All Time” type movie is something that can play more than one note. So, while I think DS is great and everyone should definitely watch it, I feel like it isn’t quite multidimensional enough to be included on a “Best of” list - unless that list is specifically for Comedies. I keep wanting to pick another comedy that could replace it on the list, and while I’m not exactly sure why, my brain keeps wanting to suggest Coming to America and/or Groundhog Day.

Yes, Neil Diamond! I thought Coming to America was it's sequel before I saw it.

I think this just gets to the heart of why it's tough to judge comedies. Airplane! is an all-time classic, as are the top 3 or 4 Mel Brooks movies. But just speaking personally, none of them makes me laugh as much as Duck Soup and Horse Feathers. (If you're interested, Airplane! was on the AFI ballot, as well as Young Frankenstein, The Producers, and Blazing Saddles, the last of which I can't believe didn't make the list.)

I don’t think Duck Soup will be a frequent rewatch for me, but I’m glad it exists and influenced other great comedies. One of my favorite comedy lines ever is from Wayne’s World 2. Kim Basinger’s character, Honey Hornee, and Garth are about to get down. She says “take me, Garth!” and he says with a deadpan “where? I’m low on gas and you need a jacket.” I don’t think I’m stretching it to say this could have been part of a Marx Bros bit. So I recognize Duck Soup for being a huge influence on comedies, and there were important bits sprinkled throughout, but as a whole, it just didn’t work for me. Yes, I love puns, but there’s so much rapid fire string of dadjokes I can take in one sitting. And sure, it might have been “the first” since the sound era, but I honestly don’t know if we would’ve had Duck Soup without The General preceding it.

I mean, it's a fine comedy, but there's no pathos. There's no emotional center. And I think this goes back to what Conan was saying about (oh, I'm going to fuck this up) sentimentality (Chaplin) vs Anarchy (Marx Bros). For me, a good drama has elements of comedy and a good comedy should have elements of drama. That's what I mean by "one note." So, yes, there are different styles of comedy in it, but it's still, essentially, a zany comedy. And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. That doesn't make it bad. But without that depth of scope, I don't know how it can be considered "the greatest." It has really good jokes, but so does Airplane!. Furthermore, as I said before, Duck Soup isn't doing anything terribly compelling from a filmmaking perspective. The cinematography and direction are both pretty basic. There aren't any great leaps in technique - aside from it being a talking comedy. I'm just asking, besides "The Marx Bros are some funny dudes," why does this deserve to be on the list?

Echoing what AlmostAGhost (and Paul and Amy) said, I think this is more than one note. Each Marx brother has a distinct comedy they specialize in. They have overlap (except Harpo needs to work on his wordplay). I guess the is an overall zany tone that stays with the movie that I guess could qualify as one note. But I think that note is "Marx brothers" I'll 100% agree on Coming To America and Groundhog Day getting included though. I'm not sure we need multiple Marx Brothers movies (though I remember liking Horse Feathers a lot). And there's nothing on this list like Coming To America and Groundhog Day.

When I made a list a couple years ago of my favorite 25 films over 25 years old, Groundhog Day was the only comedy on the list above Duck Soup. It really really should get more praise than it does. I'd also say What's Up, Doc? should get consideration, although it's largely a tribute to the type of humor the Marx brothers utilized. And of course, I also very much think Duck Soup belongs on the list. Duck Soup was definitely one of them. The Paramount Marx brothers films were on TV some weekend, and my dad made sure to record them with the VCR so we could watch over and over. His favorites were Horse Feathers and Animal Crackers. I was never into Animal Crackers as much, and Horse Feathers was my favorite as a kid, but when I revisited them in college or so, I realized that Duck Soup is the one that keeps me laughing the most from beginning to end.

I find it weird that Conan praises the movie for having a plot device to install Groucho as leader, but the first two or three minutes are just that (I.e. Freedonia is bankrupt and need Mrs. Teasdale’s money, but she will only give them the money they need if they install Firefly, a man she loves, as the new leader). Although, to be fair, those first few minutes are pretty boring and he might have just forgot...

Quick aside, what comedies did our fathers show us when we were kids? I know my father made me watch Monty Python and their movies and George Carlin when I was far too young to fully get them.

How does your mom feel about Jesus Christ Superstar (1973)?

Sure, but if we want to go that route, we can find forms in Marx Brothers movies too. They do play the same characters more or less, every time. They're usually up against some sort of power figure/power structure. Duck Soup loses a few of the norms of their earlier vaudeville-ier movies (romances, songs, etc.), but there's still some structure. The story is nonsense, sure, but it's not pure disconnected bits. Conan's point though was that they focused solely on comedy. Nobody in here is doing it, Paul & Amy did a little at the end of the show, but focusing on the political angles of Duck Soup misses the point. Mussolini missed the point, haha. Anyway, that's what I believe Conan meant. Conan out of nowhere could have Frankenstein wander out and be weird, and it was hilarious. Harpo could end up in someone's bathtub for no reason in the same way.

I can't say Duck Soup did anything in terms of comedy. I enjoyed some of the word play, but slapstick is just not my style. I also don't find it to be that innovative. It seems to me that they took their vaudeville act(s) and applied it to cinema now that they moved to talkies. The one thing I kept thinking when watching it was, "yeah, that would definitely not play in a silent film!" Did I think the mirror scene was great? Of course! But I'm not left really feeling like they did anything all that special for film. I agree with what's been said already, that I think it's a bunch of gags and word play strung together with no real story. I felt like I watched a variety sketch show with vignettes that were sort of related, but I don't feel like I watched a cohesive movie. It was okay, but I think there are a lot of really great comedies that could take it's place. Definitely something like Airplaine!* or Blazing Saddles. *At age 6 or 7, Airplane was the first time I ever saw boobs in a movie. That definitely stuck with me.

But Conan’s show has a set format each night: monologue, banter, interview, skit, musical guest (not necessarily in that order every night). Each self contained segment works by itself. I don’t think Duck Soup worked for me because the interesting bits were sort of sprinkled throughout the movie like separate skits. Taken alone, the mirror gag is amazing. But did it move the story along? I don’t know. And I don’t even know if story telling is important in a Marx Bros movie. The song and dance numbers didn’t help either. I hear you though about Conan’s show. I grew up watching it too. I still remember staying up late to watch his debut episode and I remember thinking, this is the most nervous person I’ve ever seen on tv. But you’re right, there was a definite Marx Bros-quality about his schtick that drew me in. So if Conan’s show exists because of Duck Soup, then thank goodness for Duck Soup!

Exactly, comedy is so subjective. Duck Soup didn’t make me laugh even once

I approve of your swapping them out for Buddy Holly. That's probably a bit more fair. Gee, that's a great question. Maybe you're right with Woody Allen. I mean, from the limited amount of movies I've seen, he's not exactly my cup of tea either, but you're right in terms him making comedy more artistic. Maybe Mel Brooks, too - although he might be too similar in style for this analogy.

I'll give you that, but I still stand by my assertion that being an originator or being influential doesn't automatically mean you're "The Best." If I'm permitted to switch metaphors for a moment, I'd say that Carl Perkins and Gene Vincent were both fine musicians, but I'm mainly aware of them because they influenced The Beatles.

Duck Soup (and all the Marx Bros films up to it) led the development of how to tell jokes from a filmmaking perspective. Prior to this, we had Buster Keaton and Charlie Chaplin, who were obviously brilliant but mostly silent. Even in the first Marx movies, they were sort of just recreating a stage experience. But Duck Soup advanced that. In 1933, film had just advanced past silent, and they're learning on the fly how to make comedies and be funny on this new medium of non-silent film. So think the visual things like... how they introduce Groucho or Harpo into the film, how they surprise with the tattoo close-up, shooting the mirror scene, on and on. Telling comedy via film was not done like this before Duck Soup. That's where the landmark status lies. You call that stuff 'basic' and maybe so, but the bases have to come from somewhere. It's like pre-Beatles, post-Beatles. They defined convention by defying it.

Hey if you’re like Paul and you miss Filmstruck go check if your local library card gives you access to Kanopy.com, lots of colleges and libraries are members and it also carries the Criterion collection as well as a well curated list of more popular films. Hope this helps some of you!!

I read Groucho's autobiography, he said their first four films were Broadway shows for about a year before filming. When they got to filming they'd honed all the jokes and slapstick routines. I recommend reading both Groucho and Harpo's autobiographies. There's a lot of interesting stories about them, vaudeville, and their family.

What was your first episode of HDTGM? I found HDTGM in 2016 through another podcast while I was working at a soul crushing office job. I started at the beginning with Burlesque and I managed to binge through the entire catalogue in maybe 3 months. I had never even heard of the gang before listening. Favorite catchphrase? I love What’s up Jerks! I yell it in my car. A clip or moment that you'll always remember? (timestamps are nice ) I cannot remember the episode but I died laughing in my chair when Jason revealed that clowns plagued his neighborhood growing up. The episode you revisit the most Face off and Con Air... family favorites before and even better now! The movie that you loved or hated watching I did not enjoy Free Jacked, but I’ve been pretty lucky finding bad movies I actually enjoy. I see a lot of hate for Ninja Terminator here but I friggin had a ball watching that movie! I thought there was something incredibly entertaining watching a movie made of stock footage for other movies. What the show has meant to you after all these years or any other sappy stuff I’ve discovered an entire genre of podcasts through HDTGM. Through this show I found Spontaneanation and many comedians that I would have never found otherwise. And thank you so much Paul for picking my comment on the Wraith, I know I won nothing. Like I mentioned before my old office job was killing me but because of this show I felt like I spent my days there with friends. I quit that job, I’m in a much better place now and I’ll bring you guys wherever I go. Thank you so much gang for being there and it was a dream come true to see you live in Denver! It’s honestly my dream to be a guest on the show, but we’ll see where the next 200 take us Oh and as for the next 200 I will shamelessly plug The Core, PS I Love You and The Reign of Fire for future episodes

Doh! HDTGM Jason. Zouks. Derek. Rafi. Ali (my friend) lives in Austin. Not sure where the party was but I assume close?