Episode 137 - The Avengers: LIVE!

[ChristianDavis 3]

First post

[insurgent1979 9]

So glad June was here!

 

[Cameron H. 23786]

For the record, as a male X-Men fan, I straight-up love Jubilee! I was so happy when I heard she was going to be in Apocalypse and I think it's a shame they cut her, mostly, from the movie. I also think it's a shame, that by re-introducing her in this movie, they screw up the their own timeline even further...but I guess that's neither here nor there with the X-men movies at this point.

 

Anyway...

 

 

Yeah. I loved her as a mallrat. I loved her in Generation X. I loved her as Wondra. I loved her as a vampire. And I love her as a weird vampire mama.

 

I mean, I get why she might be cloying for an older reader, but for me growing up, she functioned exactly how a sidekick is supposed to work: she was the character that I could most relate to--regardless of gender. I couldn't relate to being a Weather Goddess (at least, not as far as I'll admit to...), or a hairy, angry dude with claws coming out of his knuckles, or a sexually aggressive Cajun that could blow people up with playing cards. However, what I could relate to was wanting to hang out with those people and go on adventures with them--well, all except for maybe Gambit who has come off as a lot less "cool" as I've gotten older.

 

I guess what I'm saying is: I don't think she was ever intended as being a character to "attract female readers." To me, that's a really weird assumption, and although I can't speak for him personally, it's something I don't think Claremont--as an avowed feminist--would have been cool with.

 

Love it or hate it, I think Jubilee was just as much a product of her time (albeit, maybe a tad exaggerated) as the O5 were in the 60's (also exaggerated) when they were hanging out with Bernard the Poet at the Coffee A-Go-Go, y' dig?

 

To be honest, the only thing I find problematic about Jubilee is the fact that she's a Chinese-American character whose superpower is to...shoot fireworks. That's a big "...er, yikes" if you ask me. I wonder if, in an attempt to keep her as a character, but fix some of the more stereotypical racial aspect about her, that isn't the reason why her character has been all over the map power-wise for the last decade or so...

 

Anyway, that's been your JUBILEE JAMBOREE with Cameron H.

 

 

P.S. And don't even try to say something bad about Boom-Boom...who is/was also amazing.

 

 

 

 

[Smigg 1488]

We all know Scottland is to blame for global warming.and we all know why..

 

this is the shame they have to live with.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OHXGo8plTzY

 

did he say snowballs?

 

That's nothing, they also created the "Pizza Crunch".

 

"What is a Pizza Crunch? Is it some kind of potato chip?" I hear you ask, not literally, I'm not mental. Well, this is a Pizza Crunch.

 

 

That is a pizza, soaked in batter and then deep fried.

[Jamie Power 224]

We all know Scottland is to blame for global warming.and we all know why..

 

this is the shame they have to live with.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OHXGo8plTzY

 

did he say snowballs?

 

As someone who's eaten a deep fried mars bar, it was delicious. I'll never do it again.

[FisterRoboto 7499]

I can't stand Jubilee, but I can see why people that like her would be upset that she was cut (and it would have been nice to have a major POC mutant that wasn't a villain).

 

It's similar to what they did to Kitty Pryde (a character I do totally love) in Days of Future Past. She was supposed to be the central point of the story, but instead, she just has to facilitate Logan going back. Which is bullshit.

[Cameron H. 23786]

 

THANKS CLAREMONT

 

 

I meant to comment on this before, but how weird was it that the "Mutant Massacre" involved Thor? I mean, I get it since the Simonsons were involved, but it's like, "Here's a big event we've got planned for the X-Books. It's got all the mutant heroes you know and love...and the God of Thunder."

[NathanGordon 1096]

I guess what I'm saying is: I don't think she was ever intended as being a character to "attract female readers." To me, that's a really weird assumption, and although I can't speak for him personally, it's something I don't think Claremont--as an avowed feminist--would have been cool with.

I am 100% certain Jubes was introduced not to bring female readers into the fold, but to add some much needed levity and comic relief to a VERY angst heavy storyline, angstier than usual X-Men. It was the end of the Australia/Reavers arc, and Jubilee showed up to save a crucified Wolverine -- after Storm had been killed, Longshot had left, and Rogue gone missing. Dark times call for fireworks! She brought out Wolvie's paternal side, as well.

 

How did Jean and Magneto rebuild the school? Did they have access to a blueprint? Don't they need to mix and pour concrete? How did they hammer the nails? Are they knowledgable about installing plumbing and electrical wires?

[Cameron H. 23786]

I am 100% certain Jubes was introduced not to bring female readers into the fold, but to add some much needed levity and comic relief to a VERY angst heavy storyline, angstier than usual X-Men. It was the end of the Australia/Reavers arc, and Jubilee showed up to save a crucified Wolverine -- after Storm had been killed, Longshot had left, and Rogue gone missing. Dark times call for fireworks! She brought out Wolvie's paternal side, as well.

 

That makes sense too. Thanks to "Jay & Miles X-plain the X-men" I have made it my mission to catch up on all the Claremont stuff now, but haven't gotten to her introduction yet. Like them, I am in the middle of "Inferno"...which is actually quite a lot of fun to hear their take on the issues as I'm reading them.

 

And, to go back to the Jubilee to encourage female readers thing...the more I think about it, (in my opinion) the less sense it makes. I am too young to have read them as they came out, but I can't imagine there was a huge marketing push for her at the time. At least, no more than when Kitty Pride joined the team--which is to say, none. In fact, if we're working under the assumption that comic book readers at the time were primarily adolescent boys, how would the hypothetical girl during this time (who doesn't already read comics) even know she existed in the pre-X-men cartoon, pre-Internet, and pre-X-Men movies world?

 

In fact, the only cover I can even think of with her on it around this period is this one:

 

 

Which was a very Jubilee-centric story, but only insofar as it related to her being a young girl being forced to cope with the mortality of another young person. I mean, maybe our hypothetical 80's/90's girl saw this cover of a young woman holding a sobbing teenage girl on the cover, read the "If you only read one..." tagline, and thought to herself, "Well, I guess I should pick this up since it has teenage girl on the cover," but I highly doubt that.

 

P.S. This has got to be one of the weirdest tangents this thread has ever seen. Somehow we went from discussing the movie the Avengers to discussing the merits of Jubilee as an X-Men character.

 

 

...and I love it!

 

[jarrycanada 2483]

 

 

Wouldn't "America" technically include Cananda? North America?

 

you've never been out for canadian food? how dare you!

 

Canada's finest dinning.

 

 

Experience the tims for yourself.

[JohnGarethPartridge 5]

Not sure if this was mentioned before but what the hell is going on with the telegram to Uma to make her answer the phone? Does she not answer the phone before getting a telegram first? Does she not know what a phone is or what it is for? Unlikely - as she is a scientist after all.

 

Why does Sean need to control the weather for money when he is clearly the richest guy in England?

 

Apparently according to Steed after the opening training scene - ' the nuns were a surprise;' But what was surprising about them? They didnt kill him and he didnt kill them. But doesnt every training ground or firing range have an innocent character that you are not meant to kill? Like a kid, or a woman with a baby - or a nun? So what exactly is the surprise here?

[Cameron H. 23786]

 

you've never been out for canadian food? how dare you!

 

Canada's finest dinning.

 

 

Experience the tims for yourself.

 

Well now...if we're talking about Canadian cuisine, I'd have to add:

 

 

 

 

Granted, I haven't been back to Canada in many years, so I'm not sure if the quality has held up, but I remember always liking them.

 

And, for a place that only people in Ontario might know:

 

 

Going to Webers was a family tradition whenever we'd go visit my grandparent's cabin in Lake of Bays. If anyone is ever heading that way, and has the time to wait through their massive line, I highly recommend it!

[jarrycanada 2483]

 

 

 

 

Going to Webers was a family tradition whenever we'd go visit my grandparent's cabin in Lake of Bays. If anyone is ever heading that way, and has the time to wait through their massive line, I highly recommend it!

 

what about this place?

 

 

Let me tell you about the finest place in banff, Alberta, the grizzly house.

 

 

the greatest tourist trap you could ever walk into. over priced food that is placed at your table for you to cook. fondo style. but the service is just horrible. anyone I've ever talked to who has the provilege of eaten at this horrable place has had the same Experience. it's got phone boths that you can call other tables and talk to them, that part was fun but horrible food and terrible service.

[Cameron H. 23786]

 

what about this place?

 

 

 

Oh, I'm very familiar with Swiss Chalet! Long ago, my father used to be in advertising and they were one of his clients.

[jarrycanada 2483]

 

Oh, I'm very familiar with Swiss Chalet! Long ago, my father used to be in advertising and they were one of his clients.

 

I miss the Chalet, ours in my end of the city has burned down.. Mind you I can cook and roast chicken kick ass style. screw you, Swiss Chalet!

[jarrycanada 2483]

 

i am still dealing with the fact that we don't have a Wayne Gretzky Restaurant in Edmonton! the place where he made a name for himself...

 

They can have Mark Messier Restaurant if they wanted it but to take the great one from the city of champions, fuck you Toronto!

 

Now that makes me think what a Mark Messier Restaurant would be like, it would have to be like hooters. but with hockey theme decor. in other words it would be a total shit hole, you would not want to take your family too.

 

He's kind of like the rock but not a nice version of him..

 

Known for smashing his corvette high on cocain. ohh ya that happened. everyone remembers hearing about that story.

[Glen Toran 94]

And now the thread has lurched from run of the mill comic book nerdery to allegedly delicious Canadian eateries.

I'd be a liar if I said that this wasnt a very welcome and appetising turn of events.

[Joe Lerini 7329]

Aw, I came in here to talk comics, but the convo shifted.

 

See, I was a huge comics fan growing up, and I'd see basically anything movies or tv based on a comic book. This particular Avengers movie bummed me out because I assumed its existence prevented the creation of a movie based on the Marvel team of the same name.

 

In truth, though, aside from Iron Man (still my all-time fave superhero) the Avengers were not nearly as beloved by me as the X-Men. I loved that '92 animated series, loved the comics as well, I even picked up a VHS of the early X-Men cartoon pilot "Pryde of the X-Men" and I was a huge fan of it (my 2 favorite X-Men are Nightcrawler and Dazzler, at least initially inspired by their appearance in that pilot).

 

I did enjoy X-Men: Apocalypse when I saw it in the theater. As someone else mentioned earlier in the thread (sorry, I can't remember who) the X-Men can go in a number of different directions and don't have to be just the allegory Bryan Singer's made them for the past 16 years. I liked Apocalypse because, aside from a few moments here and there, the allegory is pushed aside so we can get a weird story about a millenia-old wannabe god who wants to take over. I would've preferred more of the focus being on the teens and less on the Xavier/Magneto relationship (either make them friends or make them enemies, stop being so wishy-washy about it). It at least seems like the next film in the series will be about these cool kids we barely got to know. So maybe I liked Apocalypse less as its own thing and more as groundwork for what's to come.

 

But, I would also be super happy with a complete and total reboot. Hopefully one including Dazzler.

[RyanSz 3140]

Aw, I came in here to talk comics, but the convo shifted.

 

See, I was a huge comics fan growing up, and I'd see basically anything movies or tv based on a comic book. This particular Avengers movie bummed me out because I assumed its existence prevented the creation of a movie based on the Marvel team of the same name.

 

In truth, though, aside from Iron Man (still my all-time fave superhero) the Avengers were not nearly as beloved by me as the X-Men. I loved that '92 animated series, loved the comics as well, I even picked up a VHS of the early X-Men cartoon pilot "Pryde of the X-Men" and I was a huge fan of it (my 2 favorite X-Men are Nightcrawler and Dazzler, at least initially inspired by their appearance in that pilot).

 

I did enjoy X-Men: Apocalypse when I saw it in the theater. As someone else mentioned earlier in the thread (sorry, I can't remember who) the X-Men can go in a number of different directions and don't have to be just the allegory Bryan Singer's made them for the past 16 years. I liked Apocalypse because, aside from a few moments here and there, the allegory is pushed aside so we can get a weird story about a millenia-old wannabe god who wants to take over. I would've preferred more of the focus being on the teens and less on the Xavier/Magneto relationship (either make them friends or make them enemies, stop being so wishy-washy about it). It at least seems like the next film in the series will be about these cool kids we barely got to know. So maybe I liked Apocalypse less as its own thing and more as groundwork for what's to come.

 

But, I would also be super happy with a complete and total reboot. Hopefully one including Dazzler.

If you haven't already started reading it, pick up X-Men '92 which was started as part of Secret Wars, it is fantastic and perfectly recreates the spirit of the show.

[FisterRoboto 7499]

It at least seems like the next film in the series will be about these cool kids we barely got to know. So maybe I liked Apocalypse less as its own thing and more as groundwork for what's to come.

 

This is the best thing about Apocalypse. I am genuinely excited about what they'll do with the kids, and since most of the contracts on the older people (as in older than teens; none of these people are old by any means) are up, maybe we'll finally get into some new ground.

 

I really wish it was someone other than Singer making the movies, though. I'm really conflicted about seeing anything he's worked on.

 

Hopefully one including Dazzler.

Aaaaaand you lost me.

 

ETA: Thanks for the tip about X-Men '92, Ryan Sz! I'll have to check that out, too. I was 11 when the cartoon came on the air, and it's what got me into Marvel (I was 8 when the Tim Burton Batman came out, which is what got me into comics, but I was just a Batman guy until the X-Men cartoon).

[Joe Lerini 7329]

If you haven't already started reading it, pick up X-Men '92 which was started as part of Secret Wars, it is fantastic and perfectly recreates the spirit of the show.

I been meaning to check it out since it was first announced, I just haven't gotten around to it.

Aaaaaand you lost me.

Aw, man!

[tomspanks 9039]

I'd love to see Squirrel Girl.

[RyanSz 3140]

ETA: Thanks for the tip about X-Men '92, Ryan Sz! I'll have to check that out, too. I was 11 when the cartoon came on the air, and it's what got me into Marvel (I was 8 when the Tim Burton Batman came out, which is what got me into comics, but I was just a Batman guy until the X-Men cartoon).

 

Yeah I was surprised at how many of the side stories for Secret Wars were really good or at least met my expectations. Out of the 45 or so I got 33 of them and can only point out a couple that outright sucked (Age of Apocalypse, Spider Island, E Is For Extinction), a few that sort of weren't what I was expecting like Old Man Logan which was the one I was most looking forward too because I loved the original story which is rumored to be one of the possible storylines for the next Wolverine movie, and many that just blew me away for how good they were (Marvel 1872, Hail Hydra, and M.O.D.O.K Assasin).

 

I'd love to see Squirrel Girl.

I would be interested to see how they would accomplish that because while the character is one of the most powerful in the Marvel Universe, she is also one of the most ridiculous. If anything I would love to see her in Deadpool 2 as a lovable, cutesy foil to Deadpool, who she has beaten in the comics on a couple occasions.

[jarrycanada 2483]

And now the thread has lurched from run of the mill comic book nerdery to allegedly delicious Canadian eateries.

I'd be a liar if I said that this wasnt a very welcome and appetising turn of events.

 

I thought this was about bad food and movies.

 

I've never watched a X-Men movie yet read the comic books.

 

sorry, my bad.

 

Wish I could find that clip of the Chappelle's Show with John Mayer playing different strokes theme song.

I'd give anything to see that again.

 

I am really angry with the fact that in that avengers not once was anyone ever offered a biscuit with that tea. or as the English call it builders tea.or is that something else

[Cameron H. 23786]

I would've preferred more of the focus being on the teens and less on the Xavier/Magneto relationship (either make them friends or make them enemies, stop being so wishy-washy about it).

 

Or just have them kiss already...