Episode 217 - Jaws 3-D

[PollyDarton 1807]

16 minutes ago, Elektra Boogaloo said:

Am I the only one ho thinks SPACE JAM was culturally relevant? I am on board with the dismissal of AVATAR. I don’t know if the remake will capture this, but there as this moment in the 90s where kids wore shirts and such Loony Tunes characters with baggy pants and backward caps. I think it started as parody, and then WB embraced it. Which is why it’s about basketball and the soundtrack is all rap and R&B. (I was very sad to delete the soundtrack from my iPod because of the R Kelly connection.) 

I don’t think it is the Looney Tunes that people really watch for? Like that is fine for kids, but older people like the music and the basketball?

 

 

It's weird. WB cartoons - Bugs Bunny, Daffy Duck, etc have always been a big part of my pop culture life. I loved them as a kid and couldn't wait to watch the Bugs Bunny Tweety Show on Saturday mornings (before wrestling,) but for some reason Space Jam was never my thing... I think that may be due to the fact that I was about 15 when it came out and was too cool for that mess.  I am aware how much it has always meant to people around my age and younger though and who could forget all the "Taz- mania" of the mid 90s.

As for Avatar, fuck Avatar. I walked out of that movie instantly forgetting about 75% of it. Dances With Wolves with Giant blue people, dragon tails and weird fireflies? Idk It's funny how little cultural impact it has had. 

[Perfect Tommy 0]

I

[Cam Bert 8145]

There is a deep dark secret hidden in this movie, and that Shelby is an alcoholic. The evidence is staring us in the face. Fact! When he's missing in the morning his boss assumes he's hungover in bed. Fact! When Kay asks what's wrong Mike says he's AWOL again. He has a history of going missing. Fact! He's He's desperate for overtime pay. He's a man that needs money by why does he need money so bad. Fact! Among his personal effects given to Mike are a stack of pawn tickets. Why is he pawning so much stuff? Again his need for money. Why does he need money so bad? Because he's slowly drinking himself to death. Frequently hungover and missing, hard up on cash, this is all evidence to his drunken benders. Let's face the fact, why would Shelby go at night to look at the fence? He didn't clock in he was doing and wasn't doing it for overtime pay so why was he there? Because he's drunk on the job! He realized that he couldn't remember if he correctly fixed the problem or not so he went back to try to hide his possible botched drunk work. In classic horror fashion the drunk or druggie has to be killed. Poor, Shelby.

[PollyDarton 1807]

16 minutes ago, Cam Bert said:

There is a deep dark secret hidden in this movie, and that Shelby is an alcoholic. The evidence is staring us in the face. Fact! When he's missing in the morning his boss assumes he's hungover in bed. Fact! When Kay asks what's wrong Mike says he's AWOL again. He has a history of going missing. Fact! He's He's desperate for overtime pay. He's a man that needs money by why does he need money so bad. Fact! Among his personal effects given to Mike are a stack of pawn tickets. Why is he pawning so much stuff? Again his need for money. Why does he need money so bad? Because he's slowly drinking himself to death. Frequently hungover and missing, hard up on cash, this is all evidence to his drunken benders. Let's face the fact, why would Shelby go at night to look at the fence? He didn't clock in he was doing and wasn't doing it for overtime pay so why was he there? Because he's drunk on the job! He realized that he couldn't remember if he correctly fixed the problem or not so he went back to try to hide his possible botched drunk work. In classic horror fashion the drunk or druggie has to be killed. Poor, Shelby.

This might explain why when his girlfriend brings Mike his belongings (because she's kicking him out of her place - he does not have his own place to live) she brings a SINGLE dufflebag that really didn't seem that full.

Only one counter argument:

Them sweet abs.

[Cam Bert 8145]

6 minutes ago, PollyDarton said:

This might explain why when his girlfriend brings Mike his belongings (because she's kicking him out of her place - he does not have his own place to live) she brings a SINGLE dufflebag that really didn't seem that full.

True the physic doesn't speak to an alcoholic per say, but he does have a very physically demanding job. For all we know when he started working for Mike he was twice the size. His weird tattoo on his arm speaks even further to a drunken night. Also, he is hitting on the skiers, the girl in the souvenir stand all while having a girlfriend he does live with. Which... if he lives with her where would be waking up hangover? The fact none of them care about this or find it strange further points to a pattern of reckless behavior.

[Robert Denby 103]

50 minutes ago, Cam Bert said:

There is a deep dark secret hidden in this movie, and that Shelby is an alcoholic. The evidence is staring us in the face. Fact! When he's missing in the morning his boss assumes he's hungover in bed. Fact! When Kay asks what's wrong Mike says he's AWOL again. He has a history of going missing. Fact! He's He's desperate for overtime pay. He's a man that needs money by why does he need money so bad. Fact! Among his personal effects given to Mike are a stack of pawn tickets. Why is he pawning so much stuff? Again his need for money. Why does he need money so bad? Because he's slowly drinking himself to death. Frequently hungover and missing, hard up on cash, this is all evidence to his drunken benders. Let's face the fact, why would Shelby go at night to look at the fence? He didn't clock in he was doing and wasn't doing it for overtime pay so why was he there? Because he's drunk on the job! He realized that he couldn't remember if he correctly fixed the problem or not so he went back to try to hide his possible botched drunk work. In classic horror fashion the drunk or druggie has to be killed. Poor, Shelby.

“Days of Wine And Roses And Sharks”

[muttnik 476]

7 hours ago, gigi-tastic said:

I never thought I would have a Childhood Story like Paul! I also tried to French kiss my mom when I was in kindergarten because my babysitter had been watching something and I thought I had been kissing my mom goodbye wrong . Unlike Paul *I* instantly realized my mom was not here for it so I turned it into a fish kiss by doing that thing where you suck in your cheeks like a little fishy mouth. 

Apparently fish kisses aren't that great either. That was an awkward drop off.

I can't wait to talk about this brand new formerly repressed memory in therapy next week. Thanks Paul!

I don't recall any kissing disasters, but I too used to pour myself a drink after school and pretend it was an adult beverage. Like apple juice in a cold beer glass, grape juice in the wine glasses, and Sprite with an olive and toothpick in a small tumbler because we didn't have anything close to a martini glass. There were construction paper cigarettes too. Much worse, I used to take a big plastic tumbler and fill it with strawberry soda- my stand-in for a goblet of goat's blood- and then kneel in front of my window for a tribute to Zeus.

[Robert Denby 103]

Mind-blowing fact- one of the writers of this movie is Richard Matheson, author of “I Am Legend,” “The Shrinking Man,” “Hell House,” and numerous “Twilight Zone” episodes, including “Terror at 20,000 Feet.” 

I’d like to think he was having drinks with one of the producers, and he told him, “Make it in 3D, that’s the only way you’re going to get people to watch it,” then demanded a writer’s credit.

[Robert Denby 103]

I think the star of the movie is the guy with the “let a gargoyle sit on your face” shirt.

 

[Robert Denby 103]

There’s a fingertip heart rate tester in the bar. I assume it’s there for safety reasons, in case a game of stand-off gets out of hand.

[gigi-tastic 2322]

2 hours ago, muttnik said:

I don't recall any kissing disasters, but I too used to pour myself a drink after school and pretend it was an adult beverage. Like apple juice in a cold beer glass, grape juice in the wine glasses, and Sprite with an olive and toothpick in a small tumbler because we didn't have anything close to a martini glass. There were construction paper cigarettes too. Much worse, I used to take a big plastic tumbler and fill it with strawberry soda- my stand-in for a goblet of goat's blood- and then kneel in front of my window for a tribute to Zeus.

I also had a *special* wine goblet from my grandma's consignment shop that I drank juice and water from and I would pretend I was a Sophisticated Adult. I also had a very tiny porcelain tea set my other grandmother gave me and I remember just mainlineing shots of hot water while reading Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire because I was 9 and couldn't reach the cupboard where the teabags were held but by God was I going to be in The Mood of this book ! 

I wish I had an alter for a  god. I'm honestly surprised I didn't because I was really into the book The Egyptian Game.

[pscudese 701]

9 hours ago, Cameron H. said:

My favorite part of the Coral Thief Murders was after Jaws ate them, he ate their boat - thus destroying the evidence! It was pretty much the perfect crime...

 

 

What’s also surprising about those “Coral Robbers,” is how easily they snuck into the facility. The costs to build it were quoted at $34 Million. Again that’s in 1983, so based on cost inflation... it’s over $87 Million nowadays.

So you’re telling me that Brody couldn’t build a proper fence to keep out the public within that budget?! I mean those guys hopped it so easily. They definitely have a lot of responsibility for their own deaths, but Brody should have done more to protect the property and essentially the dumb public. 

[Cam Bert 8145]

6 hours ago, gigi-tastic said:

I wish I had an alter for a  god. I'm honestly surprised I didn't because I was really into the book The Egyptian Game.

OMG! My grade four teacher was obsessed with that book. We had to read it in class and we did so many Egyptian related crafts and projects. We even mummified a chicken at one point. Believe me when you start telling people "I mummified a chicken in grade four" you get a lot of people slowly backing away and judging.

[Cam Bert 8145]

Here's what I still don't get and I don't think I ever will, what's the deal with this park? So they have a man made lagoon. They say that a few times. So in this lagoon in the middle they have the underwater haunted house, Spanish Gallon, coral, etc. The idea is to observe the fish, so it's full of fish as well. First this is a wacky idea because with such a large lagoon how can you assure the fish are going to be visible, also with so many small fish and a very open and lose gating system what are the chances they escape out to sea? However, the weirdest thing to me is this place seems to have tons of beaches to swim at, bumper boats to ride, ski shows to watch, etc. but these are all in that man made lagoon as well. You pay to go into a park to a private beach at a man made lagoon where there are hundreds of fish swimming about? Is that the selling point? You *might* swim with dolphins provided it's their play time. If not why not just go to a regular beach that is free? What's the point?

[The_Triple_Lindy 2482]

On 7/5/2019 at 10:32 AM, pscudese said:

So Paul mentioned how strange it was that Michael Brody (ie. Dennis Quaid) didn't call out that he's had issues with sharks in the past. No reference to Amnity, etc. But taking that a step further, I now have major annoyances with this character's reaction to a great white in Jaws 4. 

In the 4th film, Michael is pumped to follow and study a great white shark that is known to these waters. So you're telling me, after witnessing a man being eaten alive in front of you as a child (thus causing you to go into shock)... to then a great white killing co-workers and almost eating you multiple times... that when you find a 3rd GWS, you want to study it?!

Fuuuuuhhhhhccckkkk You!!! Get eaten. 

 

11 hours ago, Cameron H. said:

It’s worth pointing out that Quaid’s character does in fact refer to Great White Sharks as “murderers” - which is an absolutely insane thing to call an animal. They’re just animals. It’s not their fault. Peter Benchley himself has famously become an ardent defender of sharks in response to this kind of thinking, feeling that his book and the original movie gave people the false impression that all sharks were dangerous and should therefore be killed indiscriminately. At least, his was an accident based on ignorance. This movie is straight up like, “Great Whites? Oh yeah, they’re fucking psychos, bro. They need to die!”

But, yeah, I agree. Based on his personal history, Quaid’s career trajectory - and just his overall area of interest - is freaking bizarre. At least his brother moved to Colorado. That makes at least makes some sense. (That is, until he moves back to Amity Island, gets a job on the water, and is subsequently eaten by ANOTHER Great White shark...)

I don't feel it's that uncommon for people to take past trauma and turn it into career ambitions ... kids with infirmities becoming doctors, kids suffering abuse becoming counselors, kids whose parents were murdered becoming Batman, etc. 

[The_Triple_Lindy 2482]

10 hours ago, PollyDarton said:

This might explain why when his girlfriend brings Mike his belongings (because she's kicking him out of her place - he does not have his own place to live) she brings a SINGLE dufflebag that really didn't seem that full.

Only one counter argument:

Them sweet abs.

I bet those abs looked amazing in 3D.

[Cameron H. 23786]

4 minutes ago, The_Triple_Lindy said:

 

I don't feel it's that uncommon for people to take past trauma and turn it into career ambitions ... kids with infirmities becoming doctors, kids suffering abuse becoming counselors, kids whose parents were murdered becoming Batman, etc. 

Sure, I get that. Like, Quaid was traumatized as a child so he’s devoted his life to the construction of super max prisons for fish.

[Cameron H. 23786]

I think that it's kind of bullshit that when we first meet Quaid's character he's being a piece of crap by denying his employees any overtime to take care of a legitimate security emergency. Shelby Overman, the hunky, mustachioed beefcake who becomes baby Jaws' first victim, dies padlocking an underwater gate all by himself, sans scuba gear, working at night, without even the promise of time and a half. That's some fucking horse shit. American workers deserve fair wages for an honest day's work! 

(Speaking of Quaid as a shitty boss, there was also a small moment that made me crack up. I'm not sure if I can do it justice here, but I just wanted to share. In the scene where he and his men are trying to put together something to fix the underwater tunnel, as he is speaking to his girlfriend, he breaks off their conversation to yell to another employee "Watch how you're cutting that! It's critical!" The thing is, it's not really clear who he's even talking to and none of the extras respond to him, so the whole effect makes him look like a crazy person. I don't know, I just found it kind of hilarious. It felt like Quaid was improvising, but no one was bothering to yes/and him.)        

[grudlian. 4725]

15 hours ago, Elektra Boogaloo said:

Am I the only one ho thinks SPACE JAM was culturally relevant? I am on board with the dismissal of AVATAR. I don’t know if the remake will capture this, but there as this moment in the 90s where kids wore shirts and such Loony Tunes characters with baggy pants and backward caps. I think it started as parody, and then WB embraced it. Which is why it’s about basketball and the soundtrack is all rap and R&B. (I was very sad to delete the soundtrack from my iPod because of the R Kelly connection.) 

I don’t think it is the Looney Tunes that people really watch for? Like that is fine for kids, but older people like the music and the basketball?

 

 

I think Space Jam is a huge cultural touchstone for a small window of people probably born between 1982 and 1992. Everyone in that age range seems to have loved it. Everyone outside of that age range was kind of not interested. My recollection is that everyone wearing Looney Tunes shirts had faded out among my age group by the time Space Jam came out. But maybe Space Jam brought that back and I never noticed (or it was more of a middle school thing and I was a too cool high school student then).

As for Avatar, fuck that whole movie. I think people forget that no one really knew how it would be received before it came out. I watched it the day before it got released and my boss asked me about it. I genuinely told him I thought it wouldn't do very well. I think we can all see that I was right and that it wouldn't go on to be the biggest box office hit of all time.

[Cameron H. 23786]

I guess I’ve become sort of obsessed with the survivability of certain movie scenarios – particularly if such scenarios can be tested to some degree. In the case of Jaws 3, my main concern was with the amount of air available to the guests trapped by Mama Jaws in the underwater tunnel. So, let’s math it out!

Admittedly, we don’t have a ton of information, but based on what we’re told in the movie, here’s what we know: there are 50 people trapped, the tunnel is cylindrical, and the chamber is airtight.

We don’t know exactly how long the tunnel is, but it turns out that Sea World actually has a similar shark tunnel and it is 60 ft long. Granted, since this is a movie about a fictional theme park, I would guess the tunnel depicted would be quite a bit more impressive. So, let’s go ahead and round it up and say it’s about 100 ft long. The tube is also quite wide. From what we see, it’s at least wide enough at least for three or four people to walk comfortably side by side. In that case, I’d say a fair estimate for the tunnel’s width to be around 12ft.

So now we can use this formula to figure out the volume of a cylinder. Which works out to be: V = 100 ft x 3.14 x 6 ft squared with a solution of 11,304 cubic feet. However, it’s important to note that the tunnel in which the people are trapped is about half full of water, so we should divide our total in half, which gives Jaws’ submerged hostages approximately 5,652 cubic feet of breathable air.

Next we must determine how much air the average person consumes. According to this site, the average person consumes about 11 liters of air per minute while standing still. However, I would guess that in a crisis people would consume slightly more than that. Let's say maybe 12 liters per minute. That means that each person in that tube is breathing roughly 720 liters per hour. Times that by 50 people, and that comes to 36,000 liters per hour!

Now we have to convert liters into cubic ft - which I’ve happily done   (5,652ft³= 160,047L)

So, 50 people burning through 160,047 liters of air at a rate of 36,000 liters per hour gives this group of people just under 4.5 hours of breathable air! Which I think everyone will agree, isn’t exactly super-duper - especially when you consider that we know that the people were trapped sometime in the afternoon (or at least, early enough in the day that people were still out sunbathing). We also know, because the movie shows us, that they’re rescued just before dawn the next morning.

So, the question is: do they survive?

No, of course they don’t

Even if we were to choose a specific day to maximize their odds of survival, let’s say a day with higher than average daylight with the earliest possible sunrise, their prospects aren't great. According to this site, in Orlando in 1983, the best day for this disaster to occur would have probably been between June 14th – 16th when the sun rose at 6:27 AM and set at 8:24 PM. That means that even had they been trapped right at the very last second of daylight (which we know isn’t true) those people would have sadly run out of air sometime around 1:00 in the morning. Even if we increase our estimate of the cylinder’s diameter to, say, 15 ft, it really doesn’t extend their odds of survival beyond a couple of extra hours. No, it’s far more likely that those poor sons of bitches became permanent tourist attractions in Sea World’s haunted undersea tunnel.

(Assuming of course, they didn’t die of hypothermia first…)   

[muttnik 476]

18 hours ago, gigi-tastic said:

I also had a *special* wine goblet from my grandma's consignment shop that I drank juice and water from and I would pretend I was a Sophisticated Adult. I also had a very tiny porcelain tea set my other grandmother gave me and I remember just mainlineing shots of hot water while reading Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire because I was 9 and couldn't reach the cupboard where the teabags were held but by God was I going to be in The Mood of this book ! 

I wish I had an alter for a  god. I'm honestly surprised I didn't because I was really into the book The Egyptian Game.

I had that book too. Edith Hamilton's Mythology was like my ancient tome though; I carried it everywhere as if I could conjure the Gods and creatures inside.

I wonder what the crossover rate is for people into Lola Bunny and those into the Na'vi.

So they didn't have any security cameras in those underwater tunnels, did they? There's an underwater shot from a camera pointed at the tunnels, and one pointed at the outside of one of the filtration tanks, but nothing for inside the tunnels. That, like so much else, seems like a terrible idea. Did they have any security at the park?

[Cameron H. 23786]

1 hour ago, muttnik said:

Did they have any security at the park?

Considering that they apparently allow their employees the full run of the park at night so they can fuck in the lagoon and get into other zany hijinks, I'm going to guess that security wasn't exactly one of Sea World's primary concerns.

[gigi-tastic 2322]

7 hours ago, muttnik said:

I had that book too. Edith Hamilton's Mythology was like my ancient tome though; I carried it everywhere as if I could conjure the Gods and creatures inside.

I wonder what the crossover rate is for people into Lola Bunny and those into the Na'vi.

So they didn't have any security cameras in those underwater tunnels, did they? There's an underwater shot from a camera pointed at the tunnels, and one pointed at the outside of one of the filtration tanks, but nothing for inside the tunnels. That, like so much else, seems like a terrible idea. Did they have any security at the park?

Oh a good choice! I just was happy to get my grubby mitts on anything and everything Greco Roman and Egyptian myth related. 

I'm not sure that the same people who are into Lola Bunny would be Na'vi enthusiasts . They give off two very different energies. I do know that as a kid I appreciated Lola because she was the only girl Loony Toon besides Petunia Pig, Babs Bunny , and the poor cat that Pepe Le Pew harassed that I knew. 

 

[Cam Bert 8145]

Can I ask maybe a dumb question? What are all those barriers on the beach? Like the flag like divisors they have all over the beach that Lea Thompson plays sexy and and go seek with?

[Cameron H. 23786]

4 minutes ago, Cam Bert said:

Can I ask maybe a dumb question? What are all those barriers on the beach? Like the flag like divisors they have all over the beach that Lea Thompson plays sexy and and go seek with?

I think they're just dividers. There's a logo on one that says, "PrivaSEA." Guests can probably rent them or something to separate themselves from the riff raff. 

(Incidentally, I was checking this on my lap top while sitting next to my wife. The whole scene is pretty dimly and the logo lit right behind Lea Thompson as she's removing her clothes. I had to pause the shot to read the logo and now I'm being accused of "perving out." Thanks, man.)